What do I need to build for "Techno" query - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Multi-Way

Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 30th October 2011, 04:26 AM   #1
diyAudio Member
 
Moondog55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Norlane; Geelong: Victoria: Australia
Default What do I need to build for "Techno" query

Next door neighbour is a builder, the one who asked me to "fix" his freebie old Sansuis.
The Sansui are no longer a repair option; his uncle found out how good they actually are and kept them.
As I castigated my mate severely ( and told him how much I had spent on the Foster mid-range drivers and the XO parts for the high pass ) he has told me that if I build him a pair of speakers he will "pay" for them with the equivalent in carpenters labour.
young bloke and his main music listening is :"Techno": his wife how-ever is in the movie music business and has a preference for classical at home.

What are my targets for a speaker to perform this role in a medium sized room; 5m * 4m and a 2.7M ceiling height.

will 101db peaks be good enough or do I need to aim for club levels??

Does Techno have a lot of deep bass or is it mainly about kick-drum and a peaky 100Hz, not my usual listening music so please forgive what appears to be a beginners query.

If possible I'd like to use existing drivers and if the Jaycar polycone 10s will do the job( in a vented box for maximum punch ) I have some sonically matching mids i can use and keep the Foster for my use in the future
__________________
QUOTE" The more I know, the more I know, I know (insert maniacal laugh >here<) NOTHING"
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2011, 05:58 AM   #2
GM is online now GM  United States
diyAudio Member
 
GM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chamblee, Ga.
Looks like classic PA/DJ: Recording & Production: EQ Response Curves and Musical Style | Harmony Central

GM
__________________
Loud is Beautiful if it's Clean! As always though, the usual disclaimers apply to this post's contents.
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2011, 06:29 AM   #3
diyAudio Member
 
Moondog55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Norlane; Geelong: Victoria: Australia
A wealth of knowledge GM as usual, thanx again

Well that is a surprise, no where near as much bass as I build into mine, what I have on the shelf looks perfect for the "DOOF-DOOF", now I'm wondering if I should look at a slightly higher "Q" box to emphasise the "doof"
A smaller sealed box would have much greater WAF and fit in the room better
__________________
QUOTE" The more I know, the more I know, I know (insert maniacal laugh >here<) NOTHING"
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2011, 02:58 PM   #4
GM is online now GM  United States
diyAudio Member
 
GM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chamblee, Ga.
You're welcome! Actually, there's been it and several other musical references in prosound apps threads that I didn't have a clue what they were referring to, so Googled 'frequency response of techno music' and it magically appeared: frequency response of techno music - Google Search

Dunno about peak SPLs, I assume this music is highly compressed, so cranked up to ~100 dB average, the loudest I enjoyed R&R in a very low distortion system, though John Q. Public tends to tolerate much more distortion judging by what I've suffered through at various 'watering holes'/casual restaurants/sports bars where they have weekend live 'entertainment' [I use the term very loosely!], so seems like ~105-110 dB [distorted] peaks would be enough at home.

Anyway, getting such a high Q peak with a somewhat lower Fb typically requires a 6th order BP, so I assume they start with a typical prosound vented 'sub' that emphasizes the mid-bass and EQ it to more narrowly define the peak.

Then again, a car audio 'sub'woofer with its typically high Le, low Vas in a high Q sealed alignment appears to be ideal if XO'd low to get the mid-bass flat enough [dark blue trace].

GM
Attached Images
File Type: gif Techno music sealed woofer alignment.gif (33.8 KB, 261 views)
__________________
Loud is Beautiful if it's Clean! As always though, the usual disclaimers apply to this post's contents.
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2011, 06:56 PM   #5
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Brighton UK
Hi,

EQ of recordings does not apply to EQ of playback which should be flat.

What they tell you is where you will likely hit your SPL limits. Here what is needed
for techno is a decent sized bass driver with excursion for high upper bass levels /
clean upper bass levels at normal volumes. Throw in classical requirements and
you get to a vented box tuned low, i.e. basically a good loudspeaker.

You cannot make a speakers response suit musical styles, only capabilities.
Levels are very personal, one persons loud is anothers ridiculous levels.

10"ers should be up for the job, but tuned low for both requirements.
What are the specs of the driver in question ?

rgds, sreten.
__________________
There is nothing so practical as a really good theory - Ludwig Boltzmann
When your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail - Abraham Maslow
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2011, 07:13 PM   #6
kevinkr is offline kevinkr  United States
diyAudio Moderator
 
kevinkr's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Boston, Massachusetts
Blog Entries: 6
Since I listen to both techno and classical music I would say that Sreten's comments are pretty much dead on the money.
__________________
"Extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." - Carl Sagan
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2011, 07:50 PM   #7
diyAudio Member
 
Inductor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Cascais
Quote:
Originally Posted by Moondog55 View Post
...he has told me that if I build him a pair of speakers he will "pay" for them with the equivalent in carpenters labour.
Do you have the drivers or have to buy them? He could build the boxes for you.. Doesn't seem like a fair deal!

I would go (with a speaker good for both classical/dance) with a fair mid speaker like a compression driver and a good woofer (s) high sensitivity, and with good mid (and bass) extension. "A la" Geddes or "a la" W.Parham.
GedLee - diyAudio
Pi Speakers - unmatched quality and state-of-the-art performance

Another good one is the Troels HES, High-Efficiency Speaker Constructions with the Jantzen-audio JA8008.
QUATTRO
__________________
NEXT-proaudio Portugal
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2011, 08:46 PM   #8
seanny is offline seanny  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by GM View Post
Thanks for the link. With response curves like those, what kind of music do people whom obsess with tweeters and super tweeters listen to? I'm beginning to think those FR people are the sane ones.
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2011, 09:05 PM   #9
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Brighton UK
Quote:
Originally Posted by seanny View Post
Thanks for the link. With response curves like those, what kind of music
do people whom obsess with tweeters and super tweeters listen to?
I'm beginning to think those FR people are the sane ones.
Hi, they are not remotely response curves, they are SPL curves, rgds, sreten.

Average tweeter levels are very low, otherwise they'd all fry, but the curves
have no relation to the frequency response required, which is essentially flat.
Peak tweeter levels are high, which is why they sounds as loud as they do.

The FR bunch are not on to anything, other than it doesn't sound that bad.
__________________
There is nothing so practical as a really good theory - Ludwig Boltzmann
When your only tool is a hammer, every problem looks like a nail - Abraham Maslow

Last edited by sreten; 30th October 2011 at 09:16 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 30th October 2011, 09:41 PM   #10
diyAudio Member
 
Moondog55's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Norlane; Geelong: Victoria: Australia
The mate is a carpenter not a cabinet maker and he can do framing work I cannot so in that regard I'm happy with the deal.

Also I do have a garage full of accumulated drivers.
Hi Sreten, the woofers are cheap generic polycones, Fs 30hz; Vas 92litres; Xmax 5mm; Qms3.7; Qes0.530 ( Factory specs and these are not measured ) but the others I have used all have much lower Fs and higher Qms
They do have a ragged and peaky top end but not until 3k
Previously I have used them as sealed in 35 litre Aperiodic boxes ( fully stuffed and leaky ) where they are just OK and nothing at all special.
These will be used close to a wall do to the constraints of the listening environment.
modelling ported boxes they need a huge box (Vas * 2) but WAF will not allow a couple of 400 litre boxes in this small room and modelling says they need dual woofers to maintain 100dB without popping the voice coil out of the gap
__________________
QUOTE" The more I know, the more I know, I know (insert maniacal laugh >here<) NOTHING"
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
"TECHNO"Amp building in progress-using "Iron Method" zox2003 Solid State 23 30th March 2010 08:42 PM
What makes an amplifier "bright", "warm", or "neutral"? JohnS Solid State 51 13th December 2009 06:42 PM
Query regarding "stacking" T-lines Volenti Subwoofers 6 11th November 2005 08:27 PM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:53 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2