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-   -   What do I need to build for "Techno" query (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/199528-what-do-i-need-build-techno-query.html)

Moondog55 30th October 2011 04:26 AM

What do I need to build for "Techno" query
 
Next door neighbour is a builder, the one who asked me to "fix" his freebie old Sansuis.
The Sansui are no longer a repair option; his uncle found out how good they actually are and kept them.
As I castigated my mate severely ( and told him how much I had spent on the Foster mid-range drivers and the XO parts for the high pass ) he has told me that if I build him a pair of speakers he will "pay" for them with the equivalent in carpenters labour.
young bloke and his main music listening is :"Techno": his wife how-ever is in the movie music business and has a preference for classical at home.

What are my targets for a speaker to perform this role in a medium sized room; 5m * 4m and a 2.7M ceiling height.

will 101db peaks be good enough or do I need to aim for club levels??

Does Techno have a lot of deep bass or is it mainly about kick-drum and a peaky 100Hz, not my usual listening music so please forgive what appears to be a beginners query.

If possible I'd like to use existing drivers and if the Jaycar polycone 10s will do the job( in a vented box for maximum punch ) I have some sonically matching mids i can use and keep the Foster for my use in the future

GM 30th October 2011 05:58 AM

Looks like classic PA/DJ: Recording & Production: EQ Response Curves and Musical Style | Harmony Central

GM

Moondog55 30th October 2011 06:29 AM

A wealth of knowledge GM as usual, thanx again

Well that is a surprise, no where near as much bass as I build into mine, what I have on the shelf looks perfect for the "DOOF-DOOF", now I'm wondering if I should look at a slightly higher "Q" box to emphasise the "doof"
A smaller sealed box would have much greater WAF and fit in the room better

GM 30th October 2011 02:58 PM

1 Attachment(s)
You're welcome! Actually, there's been it and several other musical references in prosound apps threads that I didn't have a clue what they were referring to, so Googled 'frequency response of techno music' and it magically appeared: frequency response of techno music - Google Search

Dunno about peak SPLs, I assume this music is highly compressed, so cranked up to ~100 dB average, the loudest I enjoyed R&R in a very low distortion system, though John Q. Public tends to tolerate much more distortion judging by what I've suffered through at various 'watering holes'/casual restaurants/sports bars where they have weekend live 'entertainment' [I use the term very loosely!], so seems like ~105-110 dB [distorted] peaks would be enough at home.

Anyway, getting such a high Q peak with a somewhat lower Fb typically requires a 6th order BP, so I assume they start with a typical prosound vented 'sub' that emphasizes the mid-bass and EQ it to more narrowly define the peak.

Then again, a car audio 'sub'woofer with its typically high Le, low Vas in a high Q sealed alignment appears to be ideal if XO'd low to get the mid-bass flat enough [dark blue trace].

GM

sreten 30th October 2011 06:56 PM

Hi,

EQ of recordings does not apply to EQ of playback which should be flat.

What they tell you is where you will likely hit your SPL limits. Here what is needed
for techno is a decent sized bass driver with excursion for high upper bass levels /
clean upper bass levels at normal volumes. Throw in classical requirements and
you get to a vented box tuned low, i.e. basically a good loudspeaker.

You cannot make a speakers response suit musical styles, only capabilities.
Levels are very personal, one persons loud is anothers ridiculous levels.

10"ers should be up for the job, but tuned low for both requirements.
What are the specs of the driver in question ?

rgds, sreten.

kevinkr 30th October 2011 07:13 PM

Since I listen to both techno and classical music I would say that Sreten's comments are pretty much dead on the money. :D

Inductor 30th October 2011 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Moondog55 (Post 2763507)
...he has told me that if I build him a pair of speakers he will "pay" for them with the equivalent in carpenters labour.

Do you have the drivers or have to buy them? He could build the boxes for you.. Doesn't seem like a fair deal!:)

I would go (with a speaker good for both classical/dance) with a fair mid speaker like a compression driver and a good woofer (s) high sensitivity, and with good mid (and bass) extension. "A la" Geddes or "a la" W.Parham.
GedLee - diyAudio
Pi Speakers - unmatched quality and state-of-the-art performance

Another good one is the Troels HES, High-Efficiency Speaker Constructions with the Jantzen-audio JA8008.:cool:
QUATTRO

seanny 30th October 2011 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GM (Post 2763546)

Thanks for the link. With response curves like those, what kind of music do people whom obsess with tweeters and super tweeters listen to? I'm beginning to think those FR people are the sane ones.

sreten 30th October 2011 09:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seanny (Post 2764162)
Thanks for the link. With response curves like those, what kind of music
do people whom obsess with tweeters and super tweeters listen to?
I'm beginning to think those FR people are the sane ones.

Hi, they are not remotely response curves, they are SPL curves, rgds, sreten.

Average tweeter levels are very low, otherwise they'd all fry, but the curves
have no relation to the frequency response required, which is essentially flat.
Peak tweeter levels are high, which is why they sounds as loud as they do.

The FR bunch are not on to anything, other than it doesn't sound that bad.

Moondog55 30th October 2011 09:41 PM

The mate is a carpenter not a cabinet maker and he can do framing work I cannot so in that regard I'm happy with the deal.

Also I do have a garage full of accumulated drivers.
Hi Sreten, the woofers are cheap generic polycones, Fs 30hz; Vas 92litres; Xmax 5mm; Qms3.7; Qes0.530 ( Factory specs and these are not measured ) but the others I have used all have much lower Fs and higher Qms
They do have a ragged and peaky top end but not until 3k
Previously I have used them as sealed in 35 litre Aperiodic boxes ( fully stuffed and leaky ) where they are just OK and nothing at all special.
These will be used close to a wall do to the constraints of the listening environment.
modelling ported boxes they need a huge box (Vas * 2) but WAF will not allow a couple of 400 litre boxes in this small room and modelling says they need dual woofers to maintain 100dB without popping the voice coil out of the gap


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