Once you factor-in the correction for a lower freq. crossover, it's not very efficient. At 2 kHz it's around 96-97 db (and much worse lower in freq.).
So it definitely needs a new horn/waveguide. Probably better to just buy the NON-horn-loaded version and make your own. Still, IF you are doing that however, you might consider another driver.
So it definitely needs a new horn/waveguide. Probably better to just buy the NON-horn-loaded version and make your own. Still, IF you are doing that however, you might consider another driver.
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mmm...these look wrong. Very different from Beyma's curves, where it's above 100 dB sensitivity above 1100Hz...doesn't look like the non-H TPL-150 either...
This one looks better to me:
Mundorf AMT29CM1.1-R 'Concert' - €369.00 : AUDIO-HI.FI, Loudspeaker shop
(..it's priced ridiculously in the US.)
A large shallow waveguide with this should sound really good and give very good objective performance with an efficiency average of 98 db down to at least 1.5 kHz.
Mundorf AMT29CM1.1-R 'Concert' - €369.00 : AUDIO-HI.FI, Loudspeaker shop
(..it's priced ridiculously in the US.)
A large shallow waveguide with this should sound really good and give very good objective performance with an efficiency average of 98 db down to at least 1.5 kHz.
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It's not a corrected for spl graph.. so disregard that. And don't trust Beyma's measurements..
However after looking over other data, it appears that the average of the Beyma is higher in spl by about 4 db than what I stated (..my mistake was thinking that 4 kHz was 102 db, instead it's about 106 db. This means it's about 100-101 db at 2 kHz, around 95db at 1.5 kHz, and about 89db at 1.2kHz.
-I'd still select the Mundorf and craft a proper waveguide for it..
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That's perfectly OK as I am using the non horn TPL150.
Enough efficiency for a 97-98 three-way system.
My problem with the TPL150H is that I hear the (slight) coloration it has; no problem for the majority of people but it simply does not suit my musical taste.
Following my earlier post I kept thinking and ran a quick comparison, attached below.
Certainly comparing apples to oranges in some cases, such as including the 12P80Nd which of course has much higher Mms and Bl. But I find useful to keep in mind some consider this driver as a top midrange and it has high Le, high Mms/BL, and motor strength/Mms is not extremely high.
One very noticeable difference is the very low Le the Tang Band and Lowther have. The 10NDA610 is next in low Le, very low indeed for a professional driver.
The Tang Band and Lowther have very low Mms, and the Audax is close to the Lowther. Yet when comparing Mms/BL the 8PE21 looks best, forllowed by the DX3 and the Audax. And if we look at motor strength/Mms then the 8PE21 looks best, followed by the 18Sound.
Not sure if I can draw conclusions yet, but I find interesting nevertheless.
Certainly comparing apples to oranges in some cases, such as including the 12P80Nd which of course has much higher Mms and Bl. But I find useful to keep in mind some consider this driver as a top midrange and it has high Le, high Mms/BL, and motor strength/Mms is not extremely high.
One very noticeable difference is the very low Le the Tang Band and Lowther have. The 10NDA610 is next in low Le, very low indeed for a professional driver.
The Tang Band and Lowther have very low Mms, and the Audax is close to the Lowther. Yet when comparing Mms/BL the 8PE21 looks best, forllowed by the DX3 and the Audax. And if we look at motor strength/Mms then the 8PE21 looks best, followed by the 18Sound.
Not sure if I can draw conclusions yet, but I find interesting nevertheless.
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The Tang Band and Lowther have very low Mms, and the Audax is close to the Lowther. Yet when comparing Mms/BL the 8PE21 looks best, forllowed by the DX3 and the Audax. And if we look at motor strength/Mms then the 8PE21 looks best, followed by the 18Sound.
Not sure if I can draw conclusions yet, but I find interesting nevertheless.
That's probably why I like the 8PE21 so much together with TPL150
A larger more shallow waveguide with proper baffle termination should get rid of that coloration.
Why do so when I don't need to....only to align the acoustical centers...not for efficiency.
If you are happy with the 8PE21 and the results you are getting with it, then no reason at all.
BUT if you want better integration with something like the Audax (or another driver), different crossover freq./slope, etc.., then it might be able to help with that.
Have you ever compared the two side by side?
I ask because I have akways wondered about that AMT also. They are more expensive but they do make quite a few of them. I thought maybe that meant they have possibly a better tech on that driver. BUT I cant afford to randomly just buy drivers to just compare. BUT if this driver is very similar to the TPL then I may try one down the road. I prefer AMT's over CD's any day. But I have only tried the TPL. SO I would hope the Mundorf is the same.
Hello chrapladm
I recall you were planning to use a PHL 3451 as midrange with the TPL. How did it go?
I initially had 8" PHL among my candidates too. Herr Achenbach recommended that with the TPL, like in his SON speakers. We don't see much talk about PHL around here.
Faital 8PR155
Hi Dave,
This driver is so close to being the perfect mid range !
I would be all ready to jump in with both and and both feet were it not for the one question mark I have---- What about that dust cap ?
I'd like to see what kind of dust cap it has. If it is one of those ubiquitous hard plastic jobs, it will be the source of cone cry that would make a flock of geese look back. If this unit had a phase plug I would feel a lot better. I am also asking, what is the cone material ? Is it treated poly cotton, or is it just the surround that is made of that material ? It's like looking at the most beautiful young woman in the world, and hoping she has the personality to match !
FaitalPRO | LF Loudspeakers | 8PR155
http://www.faitalpro.com/en/products/LF_Loudspeakers/product_details/datasheet.php?id=101030145
p.s. These are also questions I would ask of similar make and models of drivers in the 8 or 10 inch class.
Hi Dave,
This driver is so close to being the perfect mid range !
I would be all ready to jump in with both and and both feet were it not for the one question mark I have---- What about that dust cap ?
I'd like to see what kind of dust cap it has. If it is one of those ubiquitous hard plastic jobs, it will be the source of cone cry that would make a flock of geese look back. If this unit had a phase plug I would feel a lot better. I am also asking, what is the cone material ? Is it treated poly cotton, or is it just the surround that is made of that material ? It's like looking at the most beautiful young woman in the world, and hoping she has the personality to match !
FaitalPRO | LF Loudspeakers | 8PR155
http://www.faitalpro.com/en/products/LF_Loudspeakers/product_details/datasheet.php?id=101030145
p.s. These are also questions I would ask of similar make and models of drivers in the 8 or 10 inch class.
In what respect is the 8PR155 the better choice?
The B&C 8PE21 has:
- lower moving mass;
- stronger motor;
- better frequency behavior in the crossover region around 2 kHz; a simple first order filter might be enough by using the natural roll off. The 8PR155 would require a more complex filter; also the natural roll off is less smooth.
Cone material of these Faitalpro units is coated paper.
The Faital's are fantastic. I use the 15PR400 and even that has amazing mid bass clarity. The 10pr410 is very good and really clean, midrange is silky smooth!! There is something about the faital's that separates them from others as far as sound quality is concerned. Very impressed!