Newbie in need of advice

[JacobSijsma]

Hi, I'm Jacob. I've been lurking this forum for a while and decided to register because I was planning to build a speaker.

( I will try to keep my thread as short as possible but I try to cover as much information about what I need in order to get some relevant advice. )

I currently have 2 fairly large cheap full range speakers in a closed box that don't quite live up the performance that I expect from a good speaker system. I contemplated buying studio monitors for a while now because I've got my studio setup here but its sort of a multi functional purpose desk really, I listen to music, play games and compose music all in fairly close proximity to the speaker (less than 2 meter) so I don't need floor standing living room filling speakers. However I do want to experiment with amplifiers and I don't want to need a separate subwoofer for a good bass response under my desk so after some searching on madisound I found this design:

https://www.madisound.com/pdf/fostex...fw167_2way.pdf

Its a 2 way speaker design by fostex, a bit smaller than my current setup so its gonna fit just fine. All I want to know is, do you think this is decent value for the buck ?. If not, what should I get ? My aim is at around 500 euro (maybe more or less) but money is just a guideline anyway, so not including the mdf and the tools to make an enclosure because I have that laying around.

I usually listen to music at fairly low volume levels, so no foundation shaking sound waves coming from my room, of course I need sufficient power but not a party speaker, so its for my own enjoyment and not my neighbors. Also I need a fairly versatile speaker system because I listen to all sorts of music, from the heaviest of progressive rock to chopin's piano sonata's. I'm hoping that by acquiring a multi way system the tweeter will accentuate the cymbals on drum kits better, that's always been an issue for me with my current system but that's one of many reasons for me.

[JacobSijsma]

Oh, I forgot to include some details. I'm not sure about crossover design, I mean I do know the basic concepts of inductors, resistors etc but there is such a huge difference in price for the components, especially the capacitors show a significant difference from about 5 to an astonishing 300 dollars :O!.

Also I'll supply the links to the parts, I will not be buying them from madisound though:

FT207D tweeter with a huge shielded magnet, lol:
https://www.madisound.com/store/prod...oducts_id=1265

And this is the woofer, FW167, 6.5 inch:
https://www.madisound.com/store/prod...oducts_id=1267

A good word of advice is much appreciated!

[sreten]

Hi,

There is a lot of choice out there and some of them will be far better
value than the Fostex parts and be far better developed superior designs.

e.g. :

https://www.madisound.com/store/prod...oducts_id=8806
THE ART OF SOUND PERFECTION BY SEAS - Idunn

That Fostex bass/mid is a joke at the price, Xmax = 1.5mm peak is dreadful.
The tweeter doesn't look that much better either, both poor choices.

The Idunn does seem very suitable, a far better choice.

rgds, sreten.

undefinition (see FAQs)
Zaph|Audio
FRD Consortium tools guide
RJB Audio Projects
Speaker Design Works
HTGuide Forum - A Guide to HTguide.com Completed Speaker Designs.
DIY Loudspeaker Projects Troels Gravesen
Quarter Wavelength Loudspeaker Design
The Frugal-Horns Site -- High Performance, Low Cost DIY Horn Designs
Linkwitz Lab - Loudspeaker Design
Music and Design

[AllenB]

For this kind of use you may be able to stick with a fullrange. Fostex make some good ones. They have a few good things going for them compared with a two-way.

[jerome69]

Hello,

Forget this Fostex. We could have the sensitivity to explain the price but we couldn't. Too expensive.
500€ you can do a lot of better designs than the Fostex one.
Read the choice of Troels
I can recommend this reference monitor as example but you have a lot of choices in the links above.

Have Fun.

[fatmarley]

There are a million speakers to choose from. I'd read this first, just to give you an idea of how different driver, cone materials effect the sound.

Here's another interesting read (I agree with post number 2, but I know some love the sound of polypropylene): Speaker Cone - Poly vs Paper - AudioKarma.org Home Audio Stereo Discussion Forums

Troels 'Choices' section may have something that takes your fancy: Choices

Tony gee also has some good designs on his website: Humble Homemade Hifi

[ScottG]

Zaph|Audio - 4" Bargain Mini

[sreten]

Hi,

Poly vs. paper is an old chestnut and particularly pointless to generalise.
Loads of different poly formulations and shedloads of paper formulations.

But if we are going to generalise the woven poly cone in the Idunn will
have the most neutral midrange compared to using a paper type cone.

Its a miles better choice than the Fostex drivers for sure .....

If you want paper : https://www.madisound.com/store/prod...oducts_id=8307
And also see for nearfield BSC options : Zaph|Audio - ZA-SR71

TBH though I think http://zaphaudio.com/ZMV5.html for 2m listening
would do the job far more than adequately at a far lower cost.
The old dreaded metal cones .... very high value though ....


rgds, sreten.

[fatmarley]

One other thing - If you like to listen at low volumes, some speakers sound better at low volumes than others. I wouldn't want to 'generalise' but large, sensitive speakers usually sound best at low volumes. There's nearly always an exception to every rule and the insensitive Quad electrostatic is a good example of an insensitive speaker that sounds good at low volume.

The best i've had were Tannoy DMT 10" dual concentric, studio monitors. The midrange was full of life and the bass had plenty of weight - even at very low volume levels. I'm sure they would have been even better if the drivers were made of 'treated' paper (untreated CAN sound a bit rough and/or lack detail IMO YMMV etc etc)

[JacobSijsma]

Thank you for all the reply's! I think the interesting thing about speakers is that there is so much choice and to make a choice has always been my biggest problem. As with my preference's for anything, it depends, I've heard good results with poly cones in expensive speaker systems but I don't have any bias about anything at all. Who knows maybe kevlar is the ideal speaker material, I mean b&w uses it, but paper has always worked quite ok for me.

I saw the aluminum seas woofers from one of the links, I heard arguments about aluminum being a good material to make subwoofers out of but not mid range because it resonates like any metal does when you transfer kinetic energy onto its surface, but what do I know, consider myself a newbie.

Anyway I just opened up one of the boxes my speakers been sitting in, can't find my camera so I'll try to describe my desks speakers. They are very old brand-less speakers, a closed roughly 30 liters box build out of 18mm thick mdf. The speaker baffle is made out of wood ?! and the woofers material looks more closely related to carton than actual paper, the magnet really reveals to be no larger than a bottle cap, the back of the box is stuffed with what looks like wool but the sides have no damping material at all, it does not have speaker terminals but a hole drilled in it in which the wires come in.

No wonder my friend didn't ask any money when he gave them to me haha.

Of course it has a smaller cone in the middle since its a full range speaker. As of now I realize its stupid to just dismiss full range drivers as a whole because my speakers suck altogether.

Who know I may just go with a pair of these fostex 8 inch fullranges, I mean its certainly cheaper and less time consuming. I could probably vent the box to extend the bass response as well, if the treble is not what I like I could add a super tweeter like described.

I hope I'm not upsetting anyone with this jabbering of mine

But guys I learn fast, I mean knowledge is power and if I come up with a stupid setup by all means correct me.