Distance between Woofer and Midrange driver

LageB · 15th August 2003, 06:06 PM

I think I have seen this subject earlier but could not find it. I apologize if this is a repeat question.

What is the maximum distance between woofer and midrange driver on same baffle? I have XO at 150Hz with 24dB/Octave active filter for the woofer.

I was planning on 80-100cm namely midranger (actually fullrange driver ) close to ear level, and the woofer close to floor level. Is that distance too big for such high XO point ?

LageB

SY · 15th August 2003, 06:26 PM

I've had good luck with near-floor placement of woofers. What's the size of the woofer you're using? If it's small enough, you might try crossing it over a bit higher to avoid the common upper bass/lower midrange in-room frequency response dip.

LageB · 15th August 2003, 07:00 PM

The woofer is peerless CSX 10" and the "midranger" is a Fostex fe168S (6.5") fullrange driver. Both drivers will be built in a wall so one could say I have pretty large baffle...

LageB

SY · 15th August 2003, 07:07 PM

You might try Roy Allison's trick of putting the crossover point at the notch from the floor bounce. A few measurements should get you there. That 10" will work fine even at crossover frequencies as high as 400 Hz.

LageB · 16th August 2003, 01:19 PM

Thanks SY,

But, for example in case of XO at 400Hz, would that not give some bad effect on imaging ? - with both elements separated with a distance 80-100cm - at such high XO point?

LageB

SY · 16th August 2003, 01:22 PM

If well-executed, no. Allison's speakers would be examples of that. Same with Roger Sanders' ESL hybrid systems. My last set of dynamic speakers had a pair of 17 cm midwoofers down at the floor with the midranges at ear height, crossed over at about 300 Hz. The imaging was outstanding.

GM · 17th August 2003, 04:45 AM

>What is the maximum distance between woofer and midrange driver on same baffle? I have XO at 150Hz with 24dB/Octave active filter for the woofer.

====

In the ~200-7kHz BW I like to stay within WL/pi for good summation. Below/above these points as you move further away from them you can progressively increase the distance due to our decreasing low/high hearing acuity. ~1WL should be fine and as Sy noted, within reason, positioning for best room integration is more important down low than how close the drivers are together.

GM

LageB · 17th August 2003, 10:27 AM

Thanks GM and SY,

Based on your comments I feel safe to ahead with my project as planned.

Best
Lage

5th element · 21st August 2003, 12:09 AM

I have the 10" CSX near floor and w15cy001 seas mag excel below tweets which are at eat height. The woof mid centres are close to a meter appart i think and this images well 300hz. With the bass not connected the imaging is super with the bass connected no change. The 300 hz xo is adjustable 24db active on bass and 12db on mid also adjust.

Good driver the 850146 can shift some serious air, I use them sealed at about 70 litres.

w15cy's not bad either

sound simply sensational

LageB · 21st August 2003, 05:53 AM

Thanks 5th element,
Cool! your set-up is similar to mine although I plan the XO at around 150Hz. In my case the Woofer volume (sealed) will also be somewhere between 50-70 litres.

Do you at any time feel need for a Sub, or is the CSX10" in your sealed configuration "deep" enough?

LageB

15th August 2003, 06:06 PM	#1
LageB diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden	Distance between Woofer and Midrange driver I think I have seen this subject earlier but could not find it. I apologize if this is a repeat question. What is the maximum distance between woofer and midrange driver on same baffle? I have XO at 150Hz with 24dB/Octave active filter for the woofer. I was planning on 80-100cm namely midranger (actually fullrange driver ) close to ear level, and the woofer close to floor level. Is that distance too big for such high XO point ? LageB

15th August 2003, 06:26 PM	#2
SY diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Austin, TX Blog Entries: 1	I've had good luck with near-floor placement of woofers. What's the size of the woofer you're using? If it's small enough, you might try crossing it over a bit higher to avoid the common upper bass/lower midrange in-room frequency response dip. __________________ “Listening to records is like ****ing a picture of Brigitte Bardot.” - Sergiu Celibidache

15th August 2003, 07:07 PM	#4
SY diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Austin, TX Blog Entries: 1	You might try Roy Allison's trick of putting the crossover point at the notch from the floor bounce. A few measurements should get you there. That 10" will work fine even at crossover frequencies as high as 400 Hz. __________________ “Listening to records is like ****ing a picture of Brigitte Bardot.” - Sergiu Celibidache

16th August 2003, 01:22 PM	#6
SY diyAudio Moderator Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Austin, TX Blog Entries: 1	If well-executed, no. Allison's speakers would be examples of that. Same with Roger Sanders' ESL hybrid systems. My last set of dynamic speakers had a pair of 17 cm midwoofers down at the floor with the midranges at ear height, crossed over at about 300 Hz. The imaging was outstanding. __________________ “Listening to records is like ****ing a picture of Brigitte Bardot.” - Sergiu Celibidache

17th August 2003, 04:45 AM	#7
GM diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Chamblee, Ga.	>What is the maximum distance between woofer and midrange driver on same baffle? I have XO at 150Hz with 24dB/Octave active filter for the woofer. ==== In the ~200-7kHz BW I like to stay within WL/pi for good summation. Below/above these points as you move further away from them you can progressively increase the distance due to our decreasing low/high hearing acuity. ~1WL should be fine and as Sy noted, within reason, positioning for best room integration is more important down low than how close the drivers are together. GM __________________ Loud is Beautiful if it's Clean! As always though, the usual disclaimers apply to this post's contents.


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15th August 2003, 07:00 PM	#3
LageB diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden	The woofer is peerless CSX 10" and the "midranger" is a Fostex fe168S (6.5") fullrange driver. Both drivers will be built in a wall so one could say I have pretty large baffle... LageB

16th August 2003, 01:19 PM	#5
LageB diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden	Thanks SY, But, for example in case of XO at 400Hz, would that not give some bad effect on imaging ? - with both elements separated with a distance 80-100cm - at such high XO point? LageB

17th August 2003, 10:27 AM	#8
LageB diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden	Thanks GM and SY, Based on your comments I feel safe to ahead with my project as planned. Best Lage

21st August 2003, 12:09 AM	#9
5th element diyAudio Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: England	I have the 10" CSX near floor and w15cy001 seas mag excel below tweets which are at eat height. The woof mid centres are close to a meter appart i think and this images well 300hz. With the bass not connected the imaging is super with the bass connected no change. The 300 hz xo is adjustable 24db active on bass and 12db on mid also adjust. Good driver the 850146 can shift some serious air, I use them sealed at about 70 litres. w15cy's not bad either sound simply sensational

21st August 2003, 05:53 AM	#10
LageB diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Sweden	Thanks 5th element, Cool! your set-up is similar to mine although I plan the XO at around 150Hz. In my case the Woofer volume (sealed) will also be somewhere between 50-70 litres. Do you at any time feel need for a Sub, or is the CSX10" in your sealed configuration "deep" enough? LageB

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