2 way crossover HELP!!

jmechie1 · 13th April 2011, 01:43 PM

So, I've got myself a pair of HiVi M8N's for a 2 way speaker build. Apprently theres a 10dB peak at around 2 - 2.5 kHz.

I'm just looking for a bit of help with a crossover design. I'd like to have the crossover point at about 2kHz.

Cheers, James

giralfino · 13th April 2011, 02:11 PM

I would use this driver strictly as a woofer only, for example just to 400-500 Hz.
Apart the peak at 2KHz due to breakup, there could be also some peak in the 2nd and/or 3th harmonics lower in frequency, that prevents a notch filter to be really effective.
Without distortion measure I would stay on the safe zone.
If you still want to build a 2 way, consider a small fullrange as a "tweeter".

Ralf

jmechie1 · 13th April 2011, 02:59 PM

Thanks for the quick reply. Space is a premium, so I'm going to have to stick with a 2-way design. I like the idea of using a full range in place of a tweeter, and having a lower crossover point.

I've had a quick look at full-range drivers, and they all seem to have pretty low power handling. Could you recommend any to use in a 2-way design?

James

tuxedocivic · 13th April 2011, 03:57 PM

I just heard an EL70 from CSS for the first time yesterday. It had been through Planet 10s treatment mind you. But it sounded very impressive. One of my first comments to Dave was that the treble was all there and sounded very good. We talked about bass and power handling. Crossed at 200hz it would offer tons of power. I was so impressed that I've chosen as my next design. The bad part is crossing that low will take some large xo values. $$

jmechie1 · 13th April 2011, 04:08 PM

any idea where I might be able to pick some up? I'm in the UK, and they dont seem to ship over here.. :/

tuxedocivic · 13th April 2011, 10:07 PM

Hmm, I'm not sure. Did you just look at CSS's website? Planet 10's website might help. They might ship to the UK. $160 I think for a matched and treated pair though. More expensive than CSS but possibly worth it. Then there is Solen.ca who also sells them. Otherwise, perhaps you can get Mark Audio products there? If you are wanting the EL70, I can order some up and then ship them to you. Not sure how much shipping them to the UK would cost me. I can even grab them locally from Dave if you want Planet 10's extra touch.

Edit - the M8N isn't a "high end" driver. May not be worth matching to a $45 driver, although I do think that would be an awesome combo. If you want to keep it inexpensive, perhaps another full range driver would be better suited.

giralfino · 14th April 2011, 10:02 AM

Quote:

I've had a quick look at full-range drivers, and they all seem to have pretty low power handling. Could you recommend any to use in a 2-way design?

The power handling for a driver depends on the frequency range in which a manufacturer runs the test. For example, if a data sheet recommends 100Hz-20KHz as a frequency range for a driver, I think that they are using a high pass filter at 100Hz, in order to have a higher power handling value. So if you will use the same driver with a 500Hz filter I'm pretty sure you can throw more current into the driver (or better, you can put more current into the crossover).

As for a recommendation, I don't have any direct experience of small dirver apart the TB W3-871. Have a look at europe-audio for some 3" full-range. I would try a W3-315 or W3-316. Even the ultra-cheap Visaton FRS8M does look pretty good.

Ralf

PS I don't have any affiliation with europe-audio, and I can't say I like them, because they don't answer to e-mail. So if you have a problem you are on your own.

jmechie1 · 14th April 2011, 03:13 PM

I like the sound of those W3-871's. I think I'm right in saying they're the ones used in the logitech z5500 satellite speakers. The EL70's are nice too. Maybe a bit more than I'd like to pay for my first build, but definitely worth considering.

I had another look into 3-way designs, and I guess I would have the option of mounting a tweeter on top of the unit (a bit like b&w 805's).

What would you think to using the Hivi M3N's as midrange, crossing over at about 800Hz and 6kHz?

giralfino · 16th April 2011, 08:16 AM

I wouldn't try a 3 way design as my first build. And as I already said, without distortion measurements I wouldn't cross your woofer over 500 Hz.
Search on this forum some reviews about the Visaton and TB driver suggested.

Ralf

13th April 2011, 01:43 PM	#1
jmechie1 diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2011	2 way crossover HELP!! So, I've got myself a pair of HiVi M8N's for a 2 way speaker build. Apprently theres a 10dB peak at around 2 - 2.5 kHz. I'm just looking for a bit of help with a crossover design. I'd like to have the crossover point at about 2kHz. Cheers, James

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13th April 2011, 02:11 PM	#2
giralfino diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2009	I would use this driver strictly as a woofer only, for example just to 400-500 Hz. Apart the peak at 2KHz due to breakup, there could be also some peak in the 2nd and/or 3th harmonics lower in frequency, that prevents a notch filter to be really effective. Without distortion measure I would stay on the safe zone. If you still want to build a 2 way, consider a small fullrange as a "tweeter". Ralf

13th April 2011, 02:59 PM	#3
jmechie1 diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2011	Thanks for the quick reply. Space is a premium, so I'm going to have to stick with a 2-way design. I like the idea of using a full range in place of a tweeter, and having a lower crossover point. I've had a quick look at full-range drivers, and they all seem to have pretty low power handling. Could you recommend any to use in a 2-way design? James

13th April 2011, 03:57 PM	#4
tuxedocivic diyAudio Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Victoria, BC	I just heard an EL70 from CSS for the first time yesterday. It had been through Planet 10s treatment mind you. But it sounded very impressive. One of my first comments to Dave was that the treble was all there and sounded very good. We talked about bass and power handling. Crossed at 200hz it would offer tons of power. I was so impressed that I've chosen as my next design. The bad part is crossing that low will take some large xo values. $$

13th April 2011, 04:08 PM	#5
jmechie1 diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2011	any idea where I might be able to pick some up? I'm in the UK, and they dont seem to ship over here.. :/

13th April 2011, 10:07 PM	#6
tuxedocivic diyAudio Member Join Date: Jan 2011 Location: Victoria, BC	Hmm, I'm not sure. Did you just look at CSS's website? Planet 10's website might help. They might ship to the UK. $160 I think for a matched and treated pair though. More expensive than CSS but possibly worth it. Then there is Solen.ca who also sells them. Otherwise, perhaps you can get Mark Audio products there? If you are wanting the EL70, I can order some up and then ship them to you. Not sure how much shipping them to the UK would cost me. I can even grab them locally from Dave if you want Planet 10's extra touch. Edit - the M8N isn't a "high end" driver. May not be worth matching to a $45 driver, although I do think that would be an awesome combo. If you want to keep it inexpensive, perhaps another full range driver would be better suited.

14th April 2011, 03:13 PM	#8
jmechie1 diyAudio Member Join Date: Apr 2011	I like the sound of those W3-871's. I think I'm right in saying they're the ones used in the logitech z5500 satellite speakers. The EL70's are nice too. Maybe a bit more than I'd like to pay for my first build, but definitely worth considering. I had another look into 3-way designs, and I guess I would have the option of mounting a tweeter on top of the unit (a bit like b&w 805's). What would you think to using the Hivi M3N's as midrange, crossing over at about 800Hz and 6kHz?

16th April 2011, 08:16 AM	#9
giralfino diyAudio Member Join Date: Feb 2009	I wouldn't try a 3 way design as my first build. And as I already said, without distortion measurements I wouldn't cross your woofer over 500 Hz. Search on this forum some reviews about the Visaton and TB driver suggested. Ralf

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