3-way project

[KnightofAwesome]

I've got a buddy who is willing to make me up some cabinets for some speakers using MDF or any other wood for that matter. I wont be using a sub-woofer with these speakers, I believe a 3-way will work better then a 2-way in this application.

As for the projects I have looked at, these seem to be my primary focus.

Hypnos
Zaph|Audio - Bargain Aluminum MTM
Parts Express DIY Project

I would like some recommendation as to which i should build as a speaker project having hardly any background in speakers.

Thanks!
Kurt

[Moondog55]

Start with a 2-way, then progress to 2.5way then do a 3-way if you want to avoid lots of tweaking and rebuilding

[navin]

Originally Posted by Moondog55

Start with a 2-way, then progress to 2.5way then do a 3-way if you want to avoid lots of tweaking and rebuilding

Originally Posted by KnightofAwesome

I believe a 3-way will work better then a 2-way in this application.

As for the projects I have looked at, these seem to be my primary focus.

A 2 way design can be just as accurate as a 3 way design. Besides it is not easy to take a 2 way design and then modify it for 3 way at a later date. The advantages of a 3 way usually mean that one can use a tweeter with slightly higher Fs and hence often a better HF response, and a dedicated woofer and dedicated midrange like the link below
Alpheus

BTW Zaph's MTM is a 2 way. His 3 way (or 3.5way) is this one
Zaph|Audio - ZDT3.5

So is the Part's express project you linked. 3 Drivers do not mean 3 way.

All 3 of the designs you have linked are large bookshelf designs. From this I assume you are not considering floor standing speakers. If thisis your limitation then the designs you ahve chosen are quite nice. Of the lot I'd consider the one at Zaphaudio.

The other alternative is to design one from scratch. The Dayton and Peerless 8" woofers for example can go high enough to be crossoved over to their 1" dome tweeters and you can get a large MTM using 2 8" woofers.

[KnightofAwesome]

Ah, so two of the designs i posted are in fact two ways, that makes sense. But i don't understand is why there are two speakers for the same application... since both the speakers are in phase with each other, wouldn't they interfere with each other? I can understand the advantage between a two way and a three way... but not the advantage between a 2.5 way and a 2 way.

I'm just a little puzzled now as to weather i should attempt a 3-way, 2.5-way or a 2-way.

[Moondog55]

double the speaker area increase in volume (SPL ) double the voice coil and you double the ability to handle power.
Designing a 2-way is easier as you only have one crossover point and no reaction between XO components at 2 places in the audio spectrum.
2.5 way gives a bass boost and relieves the top mid-bass driver of some on the low frequency sound which improves the clarity of midrange reproduction and also increases power handling.

2.5 way speakers are usually TMM/TWW speakers, I am working on one at the moment

Bedroom music Need to build small speakers

[MatchASM]

Originally Posted by KnightofAwesome

Ah, so two of the designs i posted are in fact two ways, that makes sense. But i don't understand is why there are two speakers for the same application... since both the speakers are in phase with each other, wouldn't they interfere with each other?

Originally Posted by Moondog55

double the speaker area increase in volume (SPL ) double the voice coil and you double the ability to handle power.

This is only half of the story. Yes, indeed it is nice to have more power handling capabilities at lower frequencies, since tweeters tend to have higher SPL/Watt sensitivity. In fact, the smaller the driver radius, the higher the maximum SPL/Watt tends to be.

However, the MTM configuration has another nice benefit. The two midranges will indeed "interfere with each other". But in a good way. They will add constructively along the horizontal plane, which is where ideally the listener will be sitting. In addition, since they are sitting symmetrical w.r.t. the tweeter, no strange radiation patterns are to be expected in the crossover region. I would say this is especially nice if you are a beginner. The only thing you need to do, is get the delay of the tweeter right, and the sound will be right "on the money". In other configurations, this exercise might take considerably more time.

You might want to read about this guy.

--
Greetz,
MatchASM

[Moondog55]

Didn't want to increase the confusion by introducing too many concepts at once , i build a lot of speakers that use MTM configuration, I try and keep the midrange driver 5inchs/135mm or smaller tho i have one set here that uses 8inch mids you can only listen in the sweet dspot

[kbgl]

Originally Posted by KnightofAwesome

Ah, so two of the designs i posted are in fact two ways, that makes sense. But i don't understand is why there are two speakers for the same application... since both the speakers are in phase with each other, wouldn't they interfere with each other? I can understand the advantage between a two way and a three way... but not the advantage between a 2.5 way and a 2 way.

I'm just a little puzzled now as to weather i should attempt a 3-way, 2.5-way or a 2-way.

You stated that you are not going to use a sub, so how much bass performance are you looking for? Where in the room will the speakers be placed? How loud do you want to play them? What are your limitations on box size? What are your overall performance expectations?

[KnightofAwesome]

Originally Posted by kbgl

You stated that you are not going to use a sub, so how much bass performance are you looking for? Where in the room will the speakers be placed? How loud do you want to play them? What are your limitations on box size? What are your overall performance expectations?

For bass performance, I guess i can use a relation to something. The headphones i normally use (Grado SR-125), I find they have the right amount of bass. For my computer I'm using Logitech Z4's, I find they don't have enough bass, they don't bring that *WAM* feeling.

The speakers will be placed close to walls, they may replace my Z4's if i can make space for them, which wont be too hard.

From what i find comfortable with, they'll most likely never be played over 90db, depending if I'm half a meter away or a couple meters away.

I'd like to limit to bookshelve speakers, i don't have room for floor standing speakers. as for width and length, anything <40cm should be fine, anything larger then that would require additional accommodations, which shouldn't be too hard.

I've never dealt with any expensive speakers before, a set of paradigms and a pair of mission speakers (Which i quite enjoy, but they lack a little in the midrange). As for my overall expectations, I'd like something that has a fairly flat response and rival what I've (hardly) heard.

Researching these terms you used Moondog55!

[Moondog55]

Originally Posted by KnightofAwesome

Researching these terms you used Moondog55!

We really need a glossary in the Wiki , I'd start it but wonder if I would ever finish it, what terms need explaining??