Linkwitz Orions beaten by Behringer.... what!!?

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I also tend to believe expert opinions given by those I trust. If I have consistently seen or heard top quality work from someone, I am willing to trust his advice and opinions.

Read that book and you will be embarrassed to make the statements that you made above.
Having finally* finished and reread parts of "Thinking Fast and Slow", I still don't understand Earl's statement. Nowhere in the book could I find anything that would make me embarrassed to trust advice or opinions from someone who has shown consistently good results, methods and rationality. I looked for a reason in the book, but could not find none. I remain unembarrassed. :confused:

*Nice book full of wonderful research and ideas. The editor needed a heavier hand, tho. It was somewhat repetitive and tedious. The ideas and research would have been better served with 1/3 fewer pages. Still, a good read.
 
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I saw those in the book, yes. I do see those in myself, you and others. We are all human, we are all prone to those errors. We talk about those things all the time here on the forum.

Where the book does say don't trust the experts is in prediction. I already knew how worthless the financial press is, the book confirms that and expands on it. Prediction is difficult, but it apparently pays well to be overconfident. That's how pundits earn a living. They have little, if any, accountability.
 
Having finally* finished and reread parts of "Thinking Fast and Slow", I still don't understand Earl's statement. Nowhere in the book could I find anything that would make me embarrassed to trust advice or opinions from someone who has shown consistently good results, methods and rationality. I looked for a reason in the book, but could not find none. I remain unembarrassed. :confused:

:up:
 
This is of course true and quite consistent with the human condition. Which is why I just do not accept any of the subjective comments on any speaker within these forums. I will look at valid data, but opinions are pretty much pointless in situations like this. We latch on to what we believe and we don't let go no matter what. Its never going to be any different.

If you want to read how bad this situation really is, and trust me its worse than you can even imagine, read Thinking, Fast and Slow: Daniel Kahneman: 9780374275631: Amazon.com: Books

I tried to find a copy of the book online, and the first link is the CIA website :eek:

https://www.cia.gov/library/center-...o.-2/pdfs/Babetski-Thinking Fast and Slow.pdf
 
It is really difficult to understand what measured data reveals what unless one has first hand experience with hearing the difference before and after resolving issues. Sometimes other more subtle issues become audible, and you kind of wonder whether it's new or was originally inaudible. The process always begins with not being satisfied with a system. Generally it is easier to hear whether something is not right. Someone actually used different music to pinpoint what was not right, once I understood what he was hearing, it was easy to figure out what needed change. When one has gone through a series of this, it is possible to generate some technical criteria that will help zero in on the final design faster. The difficult thing is the design trade offs, do you design for what you think the market will like, or do you design for what you believe is reveals the performance more truthfully. Then there is the "how does it look" and how you prioritize with "how it sounds". Reading books is good, but you always want to integrate knowledge in the books with your own instead of going by the books.
 
Generally it is easier to hear whether something is not right. Someone actually used different music to pinpoint what was not right, once I understood what he was hearing, it was easy to figure out what needed change.
Yes, nothing like a "rough" recording to pinpoint problems. I'm currently listening to a '79 live recording of 2 Tone - version of ska - bands, on a very basic setup -- and doesn't this point out limitations, quick smart! This is a recording that would drive most people mad within minutes, unless they had "perfect" sound ... it gets the job done brilliantly of allowing one to decide whether one's system is 'right', without a shred of measured data ... ;)
 
I tried to find a copy of the book online, and the first link is the CIA website :eek:

https://www.cia.gov/library/center-...o.-2/pdfs/Babetski-Thinking Fast and Slow.pdf

Interesting review. This is absolutely a must read book. One of the best that I have read in a long time.

It is still funny how nobody ever seems to see Kanneman in themselves. But it is clearly in all of us. Believing that it does not apply to you is almost proof that you are probably worse than most.
 
There must be something wrong. I could not stand listening to the Behringer B2031A for more than 5 minutes.
The sound was quite harsh, probably due to the class D amp in it. ...

Interesting speakers.
By the way personally i think that drivers quality matters.
And the woofers are a little suspicious as they should, at that price.
Very good woofers are really expensive
Nevertheless this does not mean that the design cannot be very good, like i think it really is.
My feeling is that with better drivers they would embarrasse a lot of speakers indeed.
And i am actually to try this ... starting with those PP woofers ... they cannot sound good.
It is simply not possible.
But the amps inside are unbelievable. Just look at the toroidal.

Thanks and regards,
gino
 
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I have the B2031P . Sounds very good . Nothing harsh about it. Nor is it bright . Well balanced I'd say. Fantastic value for money .
Based on earlier experience with bi amplified systems I'd say that this unit has the potential to sound even better bi-amped. I have not yet opened mine ! But it will be bi-amped one day !

The active system apparently uses LM3886 chip power amps. At least the 3030A/3031A does . Not sure if the latest manufactured units have classD modules.
 
I have the smaller Behringer B2030A (as PC speakers)

Hello ! i see we are in the same wonderful Country ! Good !
by the way, i have just ordered a pair B2030A myself !
My feeling is that they are out of production or close to be.
In two weeks time i should receive them. I am optimistic.

They don't sound harsh at all.
On the contrary they sound very relaxed, smooth and are more missing some in clarity and openness compared to speakers with better drivers, which in the wrong setup can sound harsh.
They truly sound better then many expensive speakers out there.

Maybe i was not that clear. I have a personal predilection for Scanspeak drivers just to make an example.
Just one good woofer from that brand would cost like two complete Behringer speakers.
The cases are two:
1) or the quality has a cost
2) or Scanspeak is charging without reason.
I think 1). Because with a Scan woofer you get less distortion for the same level of sound pressure.
And this is completely reasonable.
Instead electronics are different. Can be made quite cheap and good i think.
Take a Scanspeak same size, put it in the Behringer.
Take a Dynaudio tweeter e put it in the Behringer.
Make some adjustments ... you get a monitor comparable with the very best out there, this is at least what i think.
At a different cost of course.
I agree .. the stock Behringer are good ... i listened to the bigger model with the 8" woofers and they were fine.
I just see a huge potential for upgrading them.

Waveguide works

maybe someone must have told them ?

An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.


Have a nice day !
Kind regards,
gino
 
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