Today my dad and I built our first experimental dipoles, and on a scale of 1-10, I give a full 10.1 for satisfaction. The drivers used are some we picked up at Radio Shack on clearance for $3 apiece, and when we got them home, I thought to myself, why even bother?
Well, as I learned today, it's all about the enclosure. The drivers in anything else I had tried sounded horrible, all midrange and no oomph, but the dipole configuration really made them into full-range speakers! I am amazed; I never believed a single transducer with no crossover could *possibly* sound this good. The bass is full, punchy, and not floppy or boomy at all, and everything else sounds great too! I even think this box sounds better than one of my $300 studio monitors in the bass department, because the bass extension is so much better.
Seriously. If you are at radio shack and see these 8" drivers on sale--they're paper through and through, with itty bitty ceramic magnets and in general they look like pieces of $#!&, snatch them up in droves--in a dipole configuration, they're the best thing since crossovers.
Well, as I learned today, it's all about the enclosure. The drivers in anything else I had tried sounded horrible, all midrange and no oomph, but the dipole configuration really made them into full-range speakers! I am amazed; I never believed a single transducer with no crossover could *possibly* sound this good. The bass is full, punchy, and not floppy or boomy at all, and everything else sounds great too! I even think this box sounds better than one of my $300 studio monitors in the bass department, because the bass extension is so much better.
Seriously. If you are at radio shack and see these 8" drivers on sale--they're paper through and through, with itty bitty ceramic magnets and in general they look like pieces of $#!&, snatch them up in droves--in a dipole configuration, they're the best thing since crossovers.
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Yes dipoles are nice...I love my Magnepans and I will probably start a project with some Tang Bands.
The absolute best part about Dipoles? The freaking cost!
Hell I even mounted 3 8" drivers to a 12x48 MDF shelf that cost all of $5...didn't sound bad....not the best drivers and the efficiency sucked wang, but it was allright for a $5 board and extra parts....radio shack 8"ers by the way....not as quite as bad as yours
The absolute best part about Dipoles? The freaking cost!
Hell I even mounted 3 8" drivers to a 12x48 MDF shelf that cost all of $5...didn't sound bad....not the best drivers and the efficiency sucked wang, but it was allright for a $5 board and extra parts....radio shack 8"ers by the way....not as quite as bad as yours
Right now it's set up as just a sub, crossed at ~100hz using my $40 digital crossover (Soundblaster Live!) but, used as a full-range speaker, it sounds very good indeed!
I haven't played with any filtering or EQ except the crossovering, largely because I don't have a measurement mic to use for such. (Wanna send me one?)I did some more side by side listening with my studio monitors and I've decided it needs more in the 10k+ range, but I haven't gotten to actually implementing that yet. Today's Sunday, and I need to go to church first.
The whole thing, outside dimensions, 10" deep, 11" wide, 20" tall.
All told, the project cost less then $20, and IMHO, leaves many commercial offerings for dead.
I haven't played with any filtering or EQ except the crossovering, largely because I don't have a measurement mic to use for such. (Wanna send me one?
)I did some more side by side listening with my studio monitors and I've decided it needs more in the 10k+ range, but I haven't gotten to actually implementing that yet. Today's Sunday, and I need to go to church first. The whole thing, outside dimensions, 10" deep, 11" wide, 20" tall.
All told, the project cost less then $20, and IMHO, leaves many commercial offerings for dead.
Actually, I'm using 2 SBLive!'s at the moment (helps with production work) and I'm going to buy a third when my pocketbook permits me to do so.
The really cool thing is that I'm not using Creative's sucky drivers, I'm using the kX drivers, available here:
http://kxproject.spb.ru/index.php?skip=1
These drivers will, when I get the third card, allow me to use the third card as a 3-way stereo crossover, at whatever frequencies and slopes I wish! It also allows for real-time effects boxing (though you might have a hard time getting enough inputs), corrective EQ, and all sorts of other cool stuff that's not possible with the normal drivers.
The model numbers? I don't have the boxes anymore but here's what's stamped on the backs of the drivers:
Radio Shack
40-1271C
8ohm, nominal 5W
MAX 10W
Korea 7 A 7
The really cool thing is that I'm not using Creative's sucky drivers, I'm using the kX drivers, available here:
http://kxproject.spb.ru/index.php?skip=1
These drivers will, when I get the third card, allow me to use the third card as a 3-way stereo crossover, at whatever frequencies and slopes I wish! It also allows for real-time effects boxing (though you might have a hard time getting enough inputs), corrective EQ, and all sorts of other cool stuff that's not possible with the normal drivers.
The model numbers? I don't have the boxes anymore but here's what's stamped on the backs of the drivers:
Radio Shack
40-1271C
8ohm, nominal 5W
MAX 10W
Korea 7 A 7
ot: sb live
wow...im pretty blown away right now.. i knew the sblive was a
great card but i never knew about the kX drivers... very interesting..
my current crossover setup is i got sb live 5.1 setup in 5.1 mode..im only using the sub out and the front channel..with bass redirection turned on..each output is going into a separate active crossover and then going to a seperate amp..
i thought i had an unusual setup but your with the soon to be 3 sound cards takes the cake.. wow..
keep me posted on how that's going..
wow...im pretty blown away right now.. i knew the sblive was a
great card but i never knew about the kX drivers... very interesting..
my current crossover setup is i got sb live 5.1 setup in 5.1 mode..im only using the sub out and the front channel..with bass redirection turned on..each output is going into a separate active crossover and then going to a seperate amp..
i thought i had an unusual setup but your with the soon to be 3 sound cards takes the cake.. wow..
keep me posted on how that's going..
heh, will-do.
Seriously though. If you were really desperate, you could use the individual outputs of the card and have a 6-way mono crossover... these drivers are just so useful, I don't know how I've lived without them for so long.
Bass redirection is great though. My studio monitors would run out of excursion below 60 hz before, but now 60 hz plays almost exclusively on the subwoofer, so I can have the whole system play louder than before.
I'm looking now at the possibility of getting drivers with greater power handling and xmax than the ones in there now; the only downside is that I'd probably lose out on the full-range capabilities of this speaker. As it stands, I just have to turn up the treble knob on my mixer and this dipole is a full-range speaker. I'm amazed.
Seriously though. If you were really desperate, you could use the individual outputs of the card and have a 6-way mono crossover... these drivers are just so useful, I don't know how I've lived without them for so long.
Bass redirection is great though. My studio monitors would run out of excursion below 60 hz before, but now 60 hz plays almost exclusively on the subwoofer, so I can have the whole system play louder than before.
I'm looking now at the possibility of getting drivers with greater power handling and xmax than the ones in there now; the only downside is that I'd probably lose out on the full-range capabilities of this speaker. As it stands, I just have to turn up the treble knob on my mixer and this dipole is a full-range speaker. I'm amazed.
From the pics of your post #1 it seems that the baffle is midway inside the open box. Is this the way they were built?
BTW, these might be the cheapest project on the forum, and possibly they sound better than others costing many times!!!Congratulations for that.
If I find some of this drivers I will give them a try.
Keep us posted on your findings please....
BTW, these might be the cheapest project on the forum, and possibly they sound better than others costing many times!!!Congratulations for that.
If I find some of this drivers I will give them a try.
Keep us posted on your findings please....
Yep, they're right in the middle. The baffle is equidistant to the front and back. What's cool is that it's not actually attached to anything--the baffle is held in place by tension from the cleats (the 1" pieces) and I don't have any vibration problems at all.
My next dipole project will be full-range 2-way PA dipoles using 15" woofers and horn tweeters. I'm hoping that having the bass coming out two sides won't cause an problems. I don't think it will though. If it does, I'll just have to get one of those new feedback destroyers...
Thanks for all the feedback, and I hope everyone else can capitolize on this method too! This is way good!
My next dipole project will be full-range 2-way PA dipoles using 15" woofers and horn tweeters. I'm hoping that having the bass coming out two sides won't cause an problems. I don't think it will though. If it does, I'll just have to get one of those new feedback destroyers...
Thanks for all the feedback, and I hope everyone else can capitolize on this method too! This is way good!
Nappylady,
Those RS drivers get decent reviews on the FR Forum ... i have a pr sitting beside my desk wondering what i'll do with them. You should damp the basket on those... it makes a big difference. (i use ductseal, but there is other stuff that will get the job done too)
Guess it is time to post my Dubloon project... they started out as an open baffle... now i'm not sure what they are.
dave
Those RS drivers get decent reviews on the FR Forum ... i have a pr sitting beside my desk wondering what i'll do with them. You should damp the basket on those... it makes a big difference. (i use ductseal, but there is other stuff that will get the job done too)
apassgear said:
Guess it is time to post my Dubloon project... they started out as an open baffle... now i'm not sure what they are.
An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.
dave
Very nice.
I'll try damping the baskets. I'm running them crossed at 101hz now, so the ringing probably isn't making that much difference, but since I'll definitely be using them as fullrangers from time to time, I will damp the baskets with something to kill (or at least seriously injure) the basket resonances.
I'll try damping the baskets. I'm running them crossed at 101hz now, so the ringing probably isn't making that much difference, but since I'll definitely be using them as fullrangers from time to time, I will damp the baskets with something to kill (or at least seriously injure
) the basket resonances.
I just got dome damping the basket on a 12" cheap-o subwoofer.
Before,if you knocked on it,it would ring like a bell,So I coated the whole basket with a thin layer of silicone,and now it's dead. Just a *thud* sound.
I also ran a bead in the crack between the basket/magnet,I noticed that helped alot on another pair of subwoofers I have.
Many years ago a friend and I picked up some of the Radioshack 8" speakers for cheap,and built a very crude bandpass box for one.
It was shocking how much that crude hodge-podge shook the house!
Those drivers could make some impressive bass. Not bad at all for the price.
Before,if you knocked on it,it would ring like a bell,So I coated the whole basket with a thin layer of silicone,and now it's dead. Just a *thud* sound.
I also ran a bead in the crack between the basket/magnet,I noticed that helped alot on another pair of subwoofers I have.
Many years ago a friend and I picked up some of the Radioshack 8" speakers for cheap,and built a very crude bandpass box for one.
It was shocking how much that crude hodge-podge shook the house!
Those drivers could make some impressive bass. Not bad at all for the price.
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