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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Fostex single-driver noob question here...
Fostex single-driver noob question here...
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Old 28th June 2003, 06:30 PM   #1
GrahamnDodder is offline GrahamnDodder  United States
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Question Fostex single-driver noob question here...

Hey, all -

Great site. After lurking a little (after discovering you all from a reference at head-fi.org) I am ready to actually ask a question!

I am leaning toward building my first set of decent speakers to be driven by my Jolida 102b integrated tube amp. The Fostex 206e's seem like a pretty good sweet spot for the single-driver design. I do not think I am ready to start designing XO's and all.

Has anyone here actually built single-driver enclosures using a fostex driver? 206/206e's especially, but would appreciate any insight into the process with this family of speakers.

If so, what did you build? Ported? Horns? Bought/scrounged design? Self-designed?

Did the sound meet your expectation? What advice would you give? What would you do differently?

Thanks for any info, and thanks for such a great info source!

I had the right to remain silent. I just didn't have the ability. (Comedian Ron White)
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Old 29th June 2003, 09:02 AM   #2
The Paulinator is offline The Paulinator  United States
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Depending on how you pick your drivers and how much you want to spend, you could easily make a two-way that only uses the simplest of crossovers on the tweeter. For example, Morel woofers have a very steep top-end roll-off that can be matched with a properly crossed over tweeter, with the woofer running full. This tends to work with drivers with large voice coils (Morel, Dynaudio)
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Old 29th June 2003, 01:31 PM   #3
DrDave is offline DrDave  Canada
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You might want to check out the full range driver forum

Single drive forum

I've not used the Fostex drivers but my first project was a single driver using the Jordan JX92S. And for the same reason, simplicity and mo crossover in the critical range. I love them.
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Old 29th June 2003, 01:45 PM   #4
Ken L is offline Ken L  United States
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I'm using the FE206E's in horns.

If you don't build a horn, you would be better to look at different Fostex drivers.

Lotta bang for the buck in Fostex.

Ken L
No longer powered by Linux - not enough apps and cross platform integration - but maybe one day
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Old 29th June 2003, 04:52 PM   #5
leadbelly is offline leadbelly  Canada
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Fostex single-driver noob question here...
The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts. Bertrand Russell
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Old 29th June 2003, 09:19 PM   #6
theChris is offline theChris
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"same reason, simplicity and mo crossover in the critical range. I love them."
-it's amazing how a simple change of n to m changes the meaining here.
if only it could be used for good, not evil...
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Old 30th June 2003, 09:59 AM   #7
Odio Yayakoshi is offline Odio Yayakoshi  Japan
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I'm just one of so many Fostex users in Japan. I'm glad to welcome a new comer to Fostex speakers.

I'm sorry I can't meet your especial demand, but I have FE-108ES in my self-designed enclosure of backloaded-horn. So the models you referred and mine are designed for.
With suitable enclosure, FE series brings out brilliant and persuasive sound. I'm satisfied with it.

If you come to be so motivated that you can't help to build, still get cool and make careful plan. In fact, my current one is 2nd built. The first was a bummer and I spoiled pretty much money.
Backloaded enclosure has so many difficulties with designing.
For the first challenge, I recommend you to build the kit of Fostex.

Good luck in your project!
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Old 30th June 2003, 06:06 PM   #8
GrahamnDodder is offline GrahamnDodder  United States
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Default Thanks, Mr. Yayakoshi

I am (currently) leaning toward a Voight Horn Pipe as shown here:


It seems like a relatively simple model to build, compared to some of the rear-folded-horn designs. Do you know of anyone who has built this design? I would probably use a 206e as the driver.

Deep base extension is not that important to me. I want good soundstaging, high efficiency and speed on the transients. I would be driving them with a Jolida 20w push/pull tube integrated amp.

Thanks much, and thanks to the others for the useful links!

I had the right to remain silent. I just didn't have the ability. (Comedian Ron White)
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Old 1st July 2003, 01:07 AM   #9
classeA is offline classeA  Canada
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Maybe you already know that backhorn design is surely one of the best design for the fe-206, but with most considerable care for damping just behind the driver to cutoff highs and mids freq, and the mouth or the end of the maze to prevent from a cavern type of sound (leave a sidepanel unglued for further works on damping).
Don't expect very deep lows however.
I suggest the D-37 Nagaoka design with at least 1 inch MDF panels.
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Old 2nd July 2003, 06:47 AM   #10
Odio Yayakoshi is offline Odio Yayakoshi  Japan
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Before telling you what you want, I?fm a little anxious about the way you call Voight?fs QWT as Voight Horn Pipe.
Voight Pipe is not really a horn because it mainly effects as Quarter Wave Tube.

Blown pipe sounds by resonance, like as organ. QWT speakers utilize this effect to improve the range and response of low.
In the case of pipe, of which one side is closed, the wavelength of resonant sound is 4 times longer than the length of pipe. To put it the way around, you need 1/4 length of pipe toward the wavelength of sound you want. That?fs why this pipe is called Quarter Wave Tube.

While, horns are to simply expand the acoustic vibration. So, the inside space of horns begins with narrow section, then gradually expands, and ends up with large surface.
Of course, Voight Pipe has this figure. But its effect as horn is very weak. Why?

Long pipes have airflow resistance that is caused by its length and narrowness. In addition, the narrower beginning section of horns strengthens the surface tension of air. These resistant factors make it not easy to drive something long as horn. To make easy, you need something to reduce these resistances.

In fact, it?fs practically impossible to reduce airflow resistance of long pipe. Because you need pretty much length by all means, and you can?ft make the pipe so wide that it will be a simple box rather than a pipe.
But as for the intensive surface tension of air, in the beginning section of horns, you can temper it by attaching something affect to broaden the surface.

Now, you can understand why trumpet needs mouthpiece. Same applies to backloaded-horn. Instead of mouthpiece, it has a room (We call it ?gair-room?h) ahead of horn. And what?fs more, this room has another effect that gathers air pressure and blows out strong enough to beat the surface tension.

I?fm sorry I explained too much about technicals, but this is the reason I insist Voight Pipe is not really a horn.

Now, about your plan of Voight Pipe. Unfortunately, I don?ft know anyone who are using Voight Pipe, but the main speaker of Mr. Nagaoka was (He passed away last year.) QWT driven by FE-208ESU.

This speaker was nicknamed ?gNessie?h because of its height. (2.7m, and total length of the pipe is 3.6m because it has a fold.) It was said that the bass range was extended to around 10Hz, but its volume wasn?ft enough so that he added sub woofer using 2 of FW-227 each channel, powered by another amplifier.

The first driver of his Nessie was FE-208sigma and the frequency response was totally flat to the low-end, setting them in the corners of his listening room. But he was not satisfied with sigma because he didn?ft feel it aggressive sound he wanted, although it was much enough when he used sigma in backloaded-horns.

He concluded it?fs the tougher load, compared with backloaded-horns, that weakens the aggressiveness of sigma in his QWT. But the stronger driver he specially ordered to Fostex (That?fs the model later known as FE-208S) came with lounder response in mid and high, so that he was annoyed by the want of low.

Therefore, he got into the bind of demands for aggressiveness and flat response. Considering his example, if you use FE-206 or 208 in Voight Pipe, you may face the same difficulty.

But some amateurs reported their Nessie with FE-208S achieved enough volume of bass, without sub, only by corner setting. These cases have one thing in common. Their listening rooms are not so large; walls (includes floor and ceiling) are made of concrete and have very good insulation of sound.

By the way, classeA cited D-37, but it was designed for FE168SS. (Currently it?fs FE168ESU) I guess it?fs just a typo of D-57.
For 20cm series, Nagaoka built D-55 for FE208S, D-57 for FE208sigma or 208S, D-58 for FE208SS. They have flat low response deep into 30-40Hz, but you need tremendous degree of resolution and struggle to build them up. I?fm giving up for them.

Another fan of Nagaoka presents the schematic of D-55 here.
Parts 35 & 36 are not wooden board. They are sheets of urethane foam. The thickness of the wood board is 21mm, and that of urethane is 60mm. The long formula means the order of setup.

Thank you for reading this long reply.
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