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Old 5th February 2010, 01:18 PM   #11
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Hi,

Thanks a lot for the comments !

Will checkout what you've suggested !

As with the zobel,Am not too sure about using it !! Am planning to use the Series Xover thingy and also will be looking at crossing it at 3K or so which should be fine ??

Let me know as to why you think its compulsory !

Thanks once again for the reply !
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Old 12th February 2010, 03:25 AM   #12
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Great effort on your part. Are you trying to make your own driver in order to avoid spending more (?) buying branded drivers or doing this just for fun ?

The foam surround is not a good idea in our climate. They do eventually crack up and break down. However some last several years ( at least 5 / 6 ) and others break down in a year or so. I have no idea which ones available locally are good enough to use. Rubber appears to be freely available and last longest. Check out the dust cap. You get different types in the market. Most appear to be paper . I think the aluminised foil types are crap .
Have you done a listening test yet ( without a crossover )? If this isn't acceptable , no matter what all the other specs are , you will have to start all over again !

I guess you must be quite conversant with all the variables in the design of drivers. Are you trying to make a mid/bass driver or a mid driver ?
You will need to look at the frequency response plot before you proceed any further.

Remember that honing the performance might take time and patience ( and money!) . So don't give up if it isn't up to expectations at first. If it has turned out well , you would have saved a lot of time.
Wish you luck with your project.
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Old 17th February 2010, 05:21 AM   #13
sumit is offline sumit  India
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Hi Soundsgreat

nice job.

Re :6.8487
Fs : 47.3723Hz
Qes :0.3228
Qts :0.3109
Qms :8.4475
Le : 0.7287
Vas : 25.8084 L
BL : 8.7027
Mms : 11.9917g
Cms :941.2622
Sensitivity :90.546@ 1M /1W

what is the Lin Xmax?
Please post few more things like Frq. responce,THD,Waterfall etc for better understanding.

Another thing...about the small hole in the back plate. I did this earlier and found it to be of very little use..... I did another measurment with 6 holes in the back plate...was relatively helpfull...the problem was noise... in an open baffel use i could measure the noise of the air exiting the back plate hole....to reduce i flared them... noise was better..... though in any case u can't hear the noise with nornal music... but pole venting axially or radially is better in terms of noise as well as cooling...

As for the Zobel... for this driver I don't think it will matter much....though how much depends on the x-over designer , fre of operation etc..... if used upto 2000Hz or so it won't matter much.... but if someone wants to use this driver in an extended range then it might help......

As for my mail.... i have plunged in to designing a reference level DAC with Tube output so for now i think driver design will have to wait..... another issue with the mail is.... I am not very good at mechine drawing....so its difficult for me to draw the motor structure and send it over to u..... would it be possible for u to ship two soft domes to me...atleast if they lie in front of me, i might be able to do something about them.... otherwise I will have to get done with the dac thing first....then do someting about the tweeter design.

many thanks
Sumit
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Old 18th February 2010, 05:46 AM   #14
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Hi,

Ashok thank you very much for the reply !

Now let me try to answer your questions,

Quote:
Are you trying to make your own driver in order to avoid spending more (?) buying branded drivers or doing this just for fun ?
This project was started off as,ways and means to find a suitable alternative to all the branded drivers which not only costs a bomb but also pain to import ! So although the first few iterations were fun but eventually the goal was to make it on par with some branded one's (I know what may think but that's the truth)

Quote:
The foam surround is not a good idea in our climate. They do eventually crack up and break down. However some last several years ( at least 5 / 6 ) and others break down in a year or so. I have no idea which ones available locally are good enough to use. Rubber appears to be freely available and last longest.
The Cones used are from Siva,also as mentioned in the first post its not purely a foam surround,Its rubberised foam which will last (at least according to me),Moreover Am not getting any good cones easily as you mention so if you have some source please do let me know so that I can try their cones as well !

Quote:
Have you done a listening test yet ( without a crossover )? If this isn't acceptable , no matter what all the other specs are , you will have to start all over again
Yes I have done listening tests with both Xover and without,actually Am burning it so that I can get a proper TS readings ! But this is what I can say as of now,The sound is very very good,have done some one to one with Peerless and Scanspeak,The Vocals are much better then both and such ! So overall Am very very happy with the results,Not only me the person who tested the drivers is so much impressed that he's asking me to make some for him !!

Quote:
I guess you must be quite conversant with all the variables in the design of drivers. Are you trying to make a mid/bass driver or a mid driver ?
Well I am studying this from (doing online studies and also other means) have got some ideas as to what constitutes to what, what spider will have what effect of the sound and what type of basket will yield in what kind results ! So still learning and its a long long way,but Am ready to travel !!

Quote:
Remember that honing the performance might take time and patience ( and money!) . So don't give up if it isn't up to expectations at first. If it has turned out well , you would have saved a lot of time.
Wish you luck with your project.
I think I've answered that already !!

Sumit thanks a tonne for the reply,was looking for your reply all this while !!

Quote:
what is the Lin Xmax?
Please post few more things like Frq. responce,THD,Waterfall etc for better understanding.
The Xmax is around 6MM or so,as you know my test jig went kaput and Am currently thinking of a best alternative solution,so Am heavily dependent on my friend who himself is busy with his work,so will surely post all the relevant data once I get hold of it !

Quote:
Another thing...about the small hole in the back plate. I did this earlier and found it to be of very little use..... I did another measurment with 6 holes in the back plate...was relatively helpfull...the problem was noise... in an open baffel use i could measure the noise of the air exiting the back plate hole....to reduce i flared them... noise was better..... though in any case u can't hear the noise with nornal music... but pole venting axially or radially is better in terms of noise as well as cooling...
Yes it was initially done to just to see the effects of it,I've already done a Pole Piece Vented proto,as said awaiting my friend to become free to take the measurements !

Quote:
As for the Zobel... for this driver I don't think it will matter much....though how much depends on the x-over designer , fre of operation etc..... if used upto 2000Hz or so it won't matter much.... but if someone wants to use this driver in an extended range then it might help......
Sumit as I mentioned earlier Am planning to go for a series Xover and will be following the Acoustic Reality's concepts !! the idea is to push this driver till at least 3K + so that I can ease of some pressure of the tweeter in the 1-3K range !

Quote:
As for my mail.... i have plunged in to designing a reference level DAC with Tube output so for now i think driver design will have to wait
Ohh Man you just made my day !! Sumit I will be very very interested in that !! Offcourse only if you wish to share the details or make one for me ! I've been checking the progress of Virens DAC as he's building of the similar type !!

I'll be really glad you can give me some details of the same !!

Quote:
would it be possible for u to ship two soft domes to me...atleast if they lie in front of me, i might be able to do something about them.... otherwise I will have to get done with the dac thing first....then do someting about the tweeter design.
Sumit as I told you Am working on new one,the moment its done I can surely ship a sample pair to you !!

Once again thank you guys for showing interest !! Am glad to see some response finally !

Regards.
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Old 18th February 2010, 09:21 AM   #15
sumit is offline sumit  India
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Hi Soundsgreat

Code:
Sumit as I told you Am working on new one,the moment its done I can surely ship a sample pair to you !!
I meant just the domes not the full tweeter........ that is if u have some extra domes. I will machine the tweeter myself in my workshop.


Code:
Ohh Man  you just made my day !! Sumit I will be very very interested in that !! Offcourse only if you wish to share the details or make one for me ! I've been checking the progress of Virens DAC as he's building of the similar type !!

I'll be really glad you can give me some details of the same !!
Well I am currenlty measuring some jitter/bandwidth and a few other parameters of the following three dacs with our circuit layout.
1) WM4781 ( wolfson's )
2) ES9018 ( ESS )
3) CS4397 (Cirus Logic )

Early Listening tests are pointing us towards CS4397, but lab results point us towards ES9018......lets see.......

The tube pre is being designed by 2 of my friends and latter we will integrate these two. Will mail you once we reach some significant progress.

Will be making only 5 initially ( 3 for 3 of us, and two for a recording studio in delhi >> funding us ) for all the rest.... will post all the details on the web, and would only make PCBs for diyers...and may be supply a few difficult to find parts too...... for u will make one no prob...

No more details here...otherwise this thread might just get diverted.


rgds
Sumit
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Old 18th February 2010, 01:55 PM   #16
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Hi,

Sumit thanks again for the reply !!

Quote:
I meant just the domes not the full tweeter........ that is if u have some extra domes. I will machine the tweeter myself in my workshop.
Ohh IC I thought you wanted the whole thing,no worries Am getting the said (PEI Dome ) Dome units in some time (have destroyed the samples I had while working ) ! I will send you a pair of the dome units as soon as I receive them !!

Quote:
Well I am currenlty measuring some jitter/bandwidth and a few other parameters of the following three dacs with our circuit layout.
1) WM4781 ( wolfson's )
2) ES9018 ( ESS )
3) CS4397 (Cirus Logic )
ESS Sabre is supposed to be the best currently as I've seen many folks use it,also the Twisted Pear's Buffalo DAC is the best example of that which always sold out in advance !! But I heard that with the ESS its not easy/possible to have a tube stage due to various issues,have read in the DAC thread, what are your views ? Will wait for the reply in a separate thread if you open one and don't want to talk here !!

Quote:
will post all the details on the web, and would only make PCBs for diyers...and may be supply a few difficult to find parts too...... for u will make one no prob...
Please do so,if you have my old ID you can mail there or else the new ID is handsome1.blr@gmail.com !! let me know the indicative costs and such so that I can prepare for the same !

Regards.
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Last edited by SoundsGreat; 18th February 2010 at 01:58 PM.
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