I don't believe cables make a difference, any input?

[Kurt von Kubik]

Originally Posted by Key

Even in the quietest of venues you still will have the noise floor of your body - your circulatory and respiratory system.

Thus no black background!

[Curly Woods]

Originally Posted by Kurt von Kubik

Thus no black background!

It is an analogy, not a color. There is no "black background". It is simply the seeming absence of lower level noise that makes the subtle details more apparent vs. other equipment. It must be the language barrier

[Kurt von Kubik]

Originally Posted by Curly Woods

Kurt,

There certainly is an obvious difference in components and how their "perceived noise levels". I have been involved in high-end audio sales for over 20+ years and have heard a great many "world class components. The best ones have a incredibly quiet noise floor, that has nothing to do with the recordings. The term "emerging from a black background" was coined to express the lack of low level noise in a audio system. It is an analogy to photography. The blacker the backround, the more vibrant and obvious the lighter (softer and subtle) colors are exposed. Again this was not an artifact of a design, it merely reflects how quiet a component is or is not in its ability to resolve low level details. Again it must be a language issue as it has been a standard to define low level noise for ever since I have been around audio.

If a language problem exists I do not know, since I did not listen to your specific "black background"
But from your discription, I find what I earlier wrote was quite acurate.

To my knowledge "black background" exists in anechoric chambers and nowhere else, and is very uncomfortable.

But if there is some barrier of understanding, I suggest you try out some cables from MIT.
They provide ecxactly the black background i am opposing.

[Curly Woods]

Originally Posted by Kurt von Kubik

If a language problem exists I do not know, since I did not listen to your specific "black background"
But from your discription, I find what I earlier wrote was quite acurate.

To my knowledge "black background" exists in anechoric chambers and nowhere else, and is very uncomfortable.

You are not "hearing" what I am saying Kurt. I thought that this was common knowledge. It is to everyone that I have ever ran into in the audio world. I guess we listen differently here in the US

[danielwritesbac]

@Kurt von Kubik

Ah, its not necessarily capacitance that causes the effect although an "NFB" capacitor (typically inverting input to ground/load resistor) can make for more dynamics and a capacitor at the output can allow an amplifier to play louder by reducing clipping, these don't contribute an "out of the black" effect. Neither case will reduce the output of the quieter notes.

However, there is a ready capacitor device that does.
I'll try to describe it (ut oh!).
Signal from preamp/source and then. . .
Perhaps, next is the amplifier's potentiometer if it has one, and then next. . .
(beginning of "passive buffer" description)
Supplies: one larger size capacitor, one potentiometer and a scrap of cable.
Attach the pins of a larger capacitor to the outboard connections of a new potentiometer of perhaps 10k or 20k. One of these outboard connections is the input feed. The output feed is the center pin (nothing else is attached to the pot's center pin). (end of passive buffer description) Go from the output of this to. . .
The amplifier's input filter capacitor.
(none of this can replace a volume control)
Turn the dial on the "passive buffer" very, very slightly and only up to the point where the slightest difference is heard, and then set it very slightly less effective.
Use "only a touch" of this effect.
Presto! "out of the black" has been installed.

This illustrates that simultaneously capacitive and resistive, in series with the signal +, may indeed make that black background effect. The simple experiment has only 2 inexpensive pieces and a scrap of cable, so its not difficult nor spendy to try it.

The neat thing about this is that the effect is variable and has an "off" position.

If your rig is highbrow, you'll want to parallel that "big cap" (the one in this experiment, mentioned just above) with a small value of the Nichicon ES or whatever you happen to have for seemly results at small signal--get a bit cleaner so that the the clarity doesn't decrease with the drive.

So, yes, you can install that "black background" effect by making a small distortion (decrease drive) at the input.

As the name "passive buffer" implies, its not particularity effective, so you'll need a decent rig to hear the effect; however, a Tripath, TDA7294, Sanyo, STK, LM1875 should be sufficient (depends on a quality power supply) and still quite inexpensive.

In this experiment, its at the small signal point and so the effect gets larger by the gain factor of the amplifier--just like an equalizer, its gain on error.
However, a speaker cable doesn't have gain after that point, so I've no clue how it could be in the range of 20 to 40 times more effective (since there's no gain to amp the effect of a speaker cable).

[cliffforrest]

Has this thread moved into a parallel universe??

Such nonsense ideas being proposed ... I must be getting senile ...

[Curly Woods]

Originally Posted by cliff

Has this thread moved into a parallel universe??

Such nonsense ideas being proposed ... I must be getting senile ...

Why would you call it nonsense Cliff? I find it difficult to believe that people claim that they design all of this great hi-fi, then claim that they can not hear the reasons for building superb components. If you can't hear the greatness, why even bother building it in the first place. That is what baffles me. Now granted, not everything out there, no matter how it measures, is capable of reproducing great sound, but it is out there.

[SY]

Originally Posted by cliff

Has this thread moved into a parallel universe??

Such nonsense ideas being proposed ... I must be getting senile ...

I wouldn't be quite so harsh. What we have is a proposed effect for which there's no subjective listening evidence, for which there's no supporting measurements, and for which there is no agreement on terminology or description. Despite this, there's also firmly stated explanations for the effect having no basis in anything that's known about wires and transistors and for which there's also no evidence.

Now maybe that's nonsense to you, but to the folks spinning tales, this is just hours of fun.

[peterbrorsson]

MIT's secret box...

http://www.hififorum.nu/forum/topic....earchTerms=MIT

Peter

edit: Oops, not a speaker cable...

[SY]

Originally Posted by peterbrorsson

MIT's secret box...

http://www.hififorum.nu/forum/topic....earchTerms=MIT

Peter

I wonder about the dielectric properties of that hot-melt and the cable tie.