I don't believe cables make a difference, any input?

[SY]

Everything in the chain has a signature

If by "signature," you mean "audible signature," then no. It's a common mantra, especially among people who sell stuff, but no. There are things that do matter and things that don't.

[Curly Woods]

Originally Posted by SY

If by "signature," you mean "audible signature," then no. It's a common mantra, especially among people who sell stuff, but no. There are things that do matter and things that don't.

Sy,

This not solely a mantra of people that sell audio components. It is also shared by people that buy components as well as those that design them too. I did not make this up to satisfy an opinion or a bias. Robert Fulton in the 70's first noticed that cabling had a "sonic signature". I also understand that some do not share this sentiment. That does not mean one or the other correct, but it does show that something somewhere between the two, is not correlating.

[Andre Visser]

Originally Posted by SY

It's a miracle that this works at all!

So the brain is some exceptional piece of equipment after all.

Originally Posted by SY

And people worry about WIRE?

Just show you how exceptional it can be.

[Andre Visser]

Originally Posted by Jakob2

@ SY,

Experimentator bias at its best.

Wishes

I actually agree with SY, what would the purpose of a blind test be if you can't even hear a difference with sighted listening?

Normally I would first listen for differences with sighted listening. Once I've found differences, it is normally possible to tell which cable is used within seconds of listening, even in blind testing.

[SY]

Originally Posted by Curly Woods

Sy,
That does not mean one or the other correct, but it does show that something somewhere between the two, is not correlating.

Yes, that tiresome old "evidence" thing. If someone, anyone, had actually presented evidence that wires can be distinguished solely by ear, assuming matched levels and frequency responses, and absent pathological components, then there would be no argument. But 30 years after Fulton's claim (actually, I think it goes back a few years more, maybe Hiraga?), we can list the evidence put forth by the wire peddlers, the audiophile world, the tweak magazines, and all of the people who ascribe "personality" to wire.

Here's the list of such evidence:
.
.
.
.
.
(sound of crickets chirping)

Nope, I understand that lots of people love their invisible horses, but they won't get you to town any faster than walking. Bald assertion, appeal to popularity, vague appeals to pseudo-physics, ad hom, and experience as a salesman or avid consumer doesn't make the horses real.

[Pano]

Originally Posted by SY

(actually, I think it goes back a few years more, maybe Hiraga?)

Could be, not sure. Mr. Hiraga certainly does (or at least did) believe in the differences. And as he was my audio mentor many years ago, I tend to trust him. After all, 3 of the 4 best sounding systems I have ever heard - he built.
They actually DID sound to me like real music played by real people on real instruments in a real space. And that was back when I worked with all the above every day.

But I'm not a big "fancy wire" guy. I like Canare or Mogami for line level and 14 gauge extension cords for speaker wire.

But that puts me in a conundrum: I have always achieved the best results by following the practices of Mr. Hiraga and his colleagues. Why shouldn't I? They built the best sounding stuff I've ever heard - and not with Voodoo but with engineering. But I have not found cables to be that big a deal. So I always feel I must be missing something.......

[Pano]

Originally Posted by Kurt von Kubik

So a lot of the answers to your question regarding:
* Dynamics?
* Bandwidth?
* Impulse response?
* Detail?

Can be answered with "just increase induction" that will make it sound like if all 4 issues are bettered.

K von K, thanks very much for your post. Very good reading. I take it then that you find inductance to be the biggest influence on the "sound" of cables?
Certainly it is going to have an influence, perhaps the largest. Well, as long as the cables are not highly capacitive, as you point out. (note: my class-d amps seem very tolerant of large capacitive loads, maybe not all are)

Far, far back in this thread there was discussion of the multi-tone tests that showed some interesting results for different speaker wire and different amps. It would be nice to know if these results could be caused mostly by inductance differences. I'll have to go back and dig up the article.

In the tests mentioned, RF noise did seem to be a problem with compression drivers, mostly because of the very low signal levels involved. Not a problem, I would think, with most drivers.

[PaleRider]

Originally Posted by tinitus

1.0-1.5mm solid core copper is plenty fore most speaker cable needs

Many have experienced the sound/music getting worse by using thick cables, and many have never realised it, unfortunately

I have even seen people using thick 1mm copper wire fore interconnects
I have no idea what these people have been thinking about

But speaker cables does effect sound
Doesnt matter if they are 1feet or 5feet, its still there

Definetly wrong. I`m using huge wires and until this day I`ve never herard any hifi-system play as natural as mine, even if they`re way more expensive.

But be aware; the copper needs some beatin in before it opens up

[PaleRider]

Originally Posted by SY

If by "signature," you mean "audible signature," then no. It's a common mantra, especially among people who sell stuff, but no. There are things that do matter and things that don't.

Correct. Like real thick solid copper wires

[PaleRider]

Originally Posted by Kurt von Kubik

So a lot of the answers to your question regarding:
* Dynamics?
* Bandwidth?
* Impulse response?
* Detail?

Can be answered with "just increase induction" that will make it sound like if all 4 issues are bettered, just until the day you take it away, and realises that it was not so, instead it was the sound of troubled electronics.

This brings us to the main issue regarding cables, they ought to be non influent on the electronics, or electrodynamics connected. Different voltages, currents and impedances throughout the system, make the design criterias completely different for IC´s and speaker cables, as well as IC´s also should be different designed, if i.e. used for a pick-up cartridge rather than at line level. But I´m very lucky to realise, that mostly it is science afterall.

Forget induction for a while, keep the wires thick & solid to decrease resistanse and all of the dirty crosstalk aso you get in multistranded wires, adding shimmer and "details" to the soundbut ruining dynamics.
No twisting, just plain solid copper gives the cleanest sound you can wish for.

I found my referance-cables decades ago. Just some cheap diy-stuff, but clean and open like nothing else.