Off Axis Speaker set-up?

[cactus bastard]

Hi guys, I'm hoping you can help me out with some simple generalizations to focus my sights a little better.

I'm looking to build my first set(s) of DIY speakers; they'll be going in my living room which is fairly small (13' x 14').

Music is pretty important to me, and I currently have cat5 running line level to several rooms in my house, with a htib or PC speakers set up in them so that I can at least retain continuity as I putter about. Obviously, they don't sound that great, and I would like a single room (to start out with at least) that has some decent sound in it.

I will never likely be sitting in the "sweet spot", so what type of speakers are going to be the most forgiving of compromised listening positions? Sitting in the corner watching a fish tank, or lying on the floor tinkering with something in the adjacent hallway as I often seem to end up?

I hear about the poor vertical dispersion of MTMs, I think this is because of nulls generated by the two mid-woofers being spaced farther than the wavelength? If I've got that correct, then why do they seem more popular than TMMs? What about full range drivers? I don't really need a huge amount of volume, so should I be focusing my attention on those? This system will also be used for home theater. When I'm listening to music, should I keep the satellite speakers on as well or stick to a traditional stereo pair?

Sorry that ended up a bit rambly; here's a summary:
I'm looking for some speaker designs where off-axis response trumps absolute sound quality.

[planet10]

Castle-style microTowers?

microTower bipolar ML-TL for CHR-70 or EL70

dave

[cactus bastard]

Those particular speakers would be destroyed by my two cats in short order, though I see there are variations without the driver on top.

The fonken is on my short list of interesting designs. I think they would be more fun to build than a plain rectangular box, and I really like the look. I really like some of the frugal horns as well. Are horn loaded speakers very directional, or do you think they would work well for me?

[planet10]

rear loaded horns are only as directional as the driver on the front. Lotus^2 or Coniston^2 hcan be configured with side firing drivers which make them much more omni-directional...

dave

PS: 10 cats here and i've never had a problem with them destroying speakers.

PPS: you in Edmonton?

[cactus bastard]

Close actually, I live in Calgary. Why did you guess Edmonton?
Don't the cats jump on top of the castles?

The main advantage to horns seems to be that when using a single, small driver, you can afford a decent quality driver for that position. I've heard mention of the fostex drivers having particularly good off axis response, or at least the f127e I think?

What are the disadvantages to horn loaded speakers, why are they not more common? Is it just the low power handling? These will be in a fairly small room driven by a harman/kardon amp which is only rated at 30W per channel anyway.

[planet10]

Originally Posted by cactus bastard

Close actually, I live in Calgary. Why did you guess Edmonton?

A guess based on your IP#. My parents lived in Calgary after i left to go to U of A. My brother i in Airdrie. So i am pretty familiar with Calgary.

Don't the cats jump on top of the castles?

No, they stay off. Sometimes they'll inspect a horn mouth.

The main advantage to horns seems to be that when using a single, small driver, you can afford a decent quality driver for that position. I've heard mention of the fostex drivers having particularly good off axis response, or at least the f127e I think?

Reasonable -- at least the treated ones i listen to. The "horns" that suit the FE127 are actually BVRs.

What are the disadvantages to horn loaded speakers, why are they not more common? Is it just the low power handling? These will be in a fairly small room driven by a harman/kardon amp which is only rated at 30W per channel anyway.

True horns tend to be big, and therfore expensive. That's why you see few in the stores, but many more by diyers. A long path horn also has a delay of the lowest frequencies as they have to pass the length of the horn. Some people are sensitive to this.

The shorter, BVR horns, are horn-like but "friendlier".

dave

[chris661]

Visaton - Lautsprecher und Zubehör, Loudspeakers and Accessories

Looks like it will have pretty good dispersion to me...

[cactus bastard]

Originally Posted by planet10

The "horns" that suit the FE127 are actually BVRs.

Oops, that's right.

The fontanas look like they'd work well, but they probably wouldn't enjoy being crowded too much. (small room full of crap - several bookshelves, 48" fish tank, 42" TV etc.)

I should also mention that I'm only interested in low-budget designs. My absolute cap is about $100 per speaker, and the less I spend, the happier I'll be

I expect cabinet design can run those little fostex drivers low enough to integrate smoothly with the sub, but I can't help wonder about the high frequencies compared to a 2-way.

The value of the tritrix recession buster kit at PE is pretty enticing. People often comment about their good off axis response. Do they mean to say "good for an MTM"? Are MT designs usually cleaner off axis than MTMs? I would expect them to be, based on what I understand so far, but I'll readily admit that I'm still near the bottom of this learning curve .

[planet10]

Tweeters will extend a bit further out, but budget ones are starting to roll off not much higher and you have an XO smack dab in the most sensitive range.
'
If you want cheap, extended atr both ends & good you should consider the Mark Audio CHR-70 or CSS EL70.

dave

[paulspencer]

Nothing beats omni speakers for your goal. I converted my mains to omni as a test for a while, and the result was quite good. I used the midbass upfiring then crossing to a forward firing tweeter. It was interesting how you could move around the room and find the character of the sound was more consistent than ever.