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Old 25th June 2009, 06:17 PM   #21
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Gabdx1,

have you read the paper?

Best, Markus
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Old 25th June 2009, 06:47 PM   #22
Gabdx1 is offline Gabdx1  Canada
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I have done tests like these and there is no way anything above 20khz can be perceived as the signal itself. What you hear is artifacts only.

My point (6) should be revised as around 5% , all the other points unchanged.

Probably the speaker company gave them money to try to prove the advantage of using it for high sample rate. Besides that, I have no doubt the higher sample rate provide better sound, all other factors being equal.
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Old 25th June 2009, 06:52 PM   #23
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Can you describe a little bit more in detail how your own tests were conducted?

Best, Markus
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Old 25th June 2009, 07:16 PM   #24
Gabdx1 is offline Gabdx1  Canada
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I don't want to publish another useless test. This is nothing personal and this test was just for testing my system and my hearing, as they are dangerous I won't ever do it again.
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Old 25th June 2009, 07:32 PM   #25
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So you only tested yourself and found that your hearing above 20kHz is limited? How can this finding lead to a general statement that (other) humans have the same limitations? Ashihara's paper shows the contrary. JASA is a peer reviewed publication.

Best, Markus
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Old 25th June 2009, 07:40 PM   #26
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Gabdx1, I always bugged the manager about turning off the ultrasonic alarm. Just for fun (being a technician also, and curious) he set up one of our calibration mics; the alarm had no output below 23KHz.

No 'subharmonics' IOW. The fact that there is variance in human physiology is well-known. *Generally* we have hearing response that is 20-20KHz, but specifically some humans have more than that while others have less, depending on variables like age, health, genetics and the like.
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Old 25th June 2009, 07:56 PM   #27
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End of the article:
: The data, therefore, may not precisely represent the actual hearing threshold values of the particular ear. Further investigations are needed to provide more accurate estimation of the hearing threshold values.

It should reformulate: 'values to hear the distortions generated by the ear apparatus, harmonics produced by the propagation of the impulse through the bone structure etc.'

The author is not addressing the harmonics generated by the ear itself which accounts for the hearing sensation of the test subjects.

Also I never assumed anything from my hearing test.

If you can start to 'hear' a 25khz test tone at 110 db good for you because that just proved we can hear over 20khz !

It is as stupid as putting a 10hz tone at 110 db and say now do you hear it? That whole article is just plain BS.
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Old 25th June 2009, 08:00 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally posted by Gabdx1
Also I never assumed anything from my hearing test.
Quote:
20khz is not a generalization, it is tested as the maximum limit, all literature and all scientific tests never ever said you can hear above it.
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Old 25th June 2009, 08:13 PM   #29
Gabdx1 is offline Gabdx1  Canada
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... you said 20khz is a generalization...
I said it is NOT, because it was tested many times and all references give that number, ok except some crappy test done by one engineer who knows probably nothing about how the ear works and who don't address any of the relevant issues.
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Old 25th June 2009, 08:18 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally posted by markus76
So you only tested yourself and found that your hearing above 20kHz is limited? How can this finding lead to a general statement that (other) humans have the same limitations? Ashihara's paper shows the contrary. JASA is a peer reviewed publication.

Best, Markus

I can barely hear above 10KHz but I am 52.

The ear has different responses at different volumes.

Some old amps used to have a loudness control that adapted the tone control for different loudnesses.
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