Best alternative to Lambda 12

Defo · 8th May 2009, 06:05 PM

After trying to get a hold of John at AE without any luck, ive began searching after an alternative.

As I see it, the Lambda drivers excell at high extension, good linearity and very low inductance (which is good for transient response right?)

Which driver is the best alternative in the same price range?

454Casull · 8th May 2009, 07:42 PM

What's the application and what is the budget?

Defo · 8th May 2009, 08:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 454Casull
What's the application and what is the budget?

50hz and up as high as possible (would love to be able to use a ribbon, allthough ill most likely will be using a compression driver) . Will use a sub. Budget is the same price range as the Lambda drivers, in other words around 500 usd for the pair.

Brett · 9th May 2009, 03:14 AM

Give John another go, or try posting on the AE forum. I gather he's a bit short staffed and swamped with orders, and has been a bit slow in responding to my emails too.

Defo · 9th May 2009, 05:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Brett
Give John another go, or try posting on the AE forum. I gather he's a bit short staffed and swamped with orders, and has been a bit slow in responding to my emails too.

Ill try, but it would still be interessting to know some other alternatives

Allthough there arent many other as good as the lambda seen on paper..

Inductor · 9th May 2009, 07:04 PM

Look at this one and tell me what do you think.

SELENIUM WPU1209-SLF
(SLF means with no logo on the front dustcap)

Brett · 9th May 2009, 08:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Defo

Ill try, but it would still be interessting to know some other alternatives Allthough there arent many other as good as the lambda seen on paper..

OTTOMH, the 18Sound 12NDA520 and the GPA/Altec 414 would be worth looking at.

I looked at the two 10NDA drivers before deciding on the AE TD10M.

John_E_Janowitz · 9th May 2009, 09:45 PM

Hi Defto,

I'm not sure where you had tried to get a hold of me. I've gone through pretty much all the emails I've had in recent weeks. Simon also messages me about all the posts on our forum www.aespeakers.com/phpbb2 and I hadn't heard anything from him. I apologize if i missed something. Please send me an email to sales at aespeakers.com and I will get back to you right away.

In answer to your original question there are very few drivers I'm aware of that come close to all the benefits of the Lambda drivers. They are a very unique combination of high bandwidth, high efficiency, low distortion, high excursion and high power handling. Many drivers address a few of these issues and come close in some of those areas but not all. The ones that often come up in comparison in terms of low distortion are those by ATC http://www.atc.gb.net/paDriveUnits.htm the audio technology flex units http://www.audiotechnology.dk/iz.asp?id=4|a|119||| Seas excel or exotic line, Scan Speak revelators, TAD 1601's, etc. Most all of these drivers still have much higher inductance, cannot play as high, have lower xmax, higher distortion, and much lower power handling. In reality the reason I first started using the Lambda drivers was because there was nothing else like them. There just isn't a close runner up even at more expense.

Comparing to a driver like the selenium isn't much of a comparison. The Selenium has a 4" coil but uses a kapton former and thin top plate. The 2" diameter coil in the Lambda has much more heat sinking area and as a result will have lower power compression and much better power handling. The 4" coil has much higher inductance and with no shorting rings both inductance non-linearity with excursion and flux modulation will create huge amounts of distortion vs a driver that properly addresses these issues.

John

John_E_Janowitz · 9th May 2009, 09:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Brett

OTTOMH, the 18Sound 12NDA520 and the GPA/Altec 414 would be worth looking at.

I looked at the two 10NDA drivers before deciding on the AE TD10M.

The AIC that eighteen sound uses does reduce inductance. If you look through their own white paper though it shows that a fixed shorting ring is more effective at lowering distortion than AIC. The other big problem with AIC is in the power handling. One, it requires the coil to be driven to work. This means you are creating more heat already by powering a second coil. You also totally take away the ability for the coil to sink any heat into the pole so you're limited to only the outer diameter of the coil to shed heat. The 12NDA520 also has only 4mm Xmax.

The Altec 414 does have an alnico motor. This helps with flux modulation as alnico is less prone to modulation than ceramic. However, with the full copper sleeve on the pole, the Lambda motor is even less prone to flux modulation than an alnico motor. You also have about 10x the power handling with the Lambda as alnico demagnetizes with heat. One of the reasons the TAD1601 is great up to 50-100W input but compression and distortion skyrocket when it gets hot. The 414 has only 3.8mm Xmax as well. Again a case where in some ways it comes close but not so close in others.

John

Brett · 9th May 2009, 10:12 PM

No argument from me John. As you know I already have 8 of your drivers and am very impressed by them. I also have another design on paper that I'm looking forward to trying later that will definitely incorporate a TD12X and possibly an AV15, but the silver cone messes with the aesthetics I'm hoping for.

Any ETA on the 6.5?

8th May 2009, 06:05 PM	#1
Defo diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2008	Best alternative to Lambda 12 After trying to get a hold of John at AE without any luck, ive began searching after an alternative. As I see it, the Lambda drivers excell at high extension, good linearity and very low inductance (which is good for transient response right?) Which driver is the best alternative in the same price range?

8th May 2009, 07:42 PM	#2
454Casull diyAudio Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Toronto, ON, Canada	What's the application and what is the budget? __________________ Building a 2.1 system out of a 3/4"x4'x8' sheet

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9th May 2009, 03:14 AM	#4
Brett diyAudio Member Join Date: Jan 2002	Give John another go, or try posting on the AE forum. I gather he's a bit short staffed and swamped with orders, and has been a bit slow in responding to my emails too.

9th May 2009, 09:45 PM	#8
John_E_Janowitz diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Green Bay, WI	Hi Defto, I'm not sure where you had tried to get a hold of me. I've gone through pretty much all the emails I've had in recent weeks. Simon also messages me about all the posts on our forum www.aespeakers.com/phpbb2 and I hadn't heard anything from him. I apologize if i missed something. Please send me an email to sales at aespeakers.com and I will get back to you right away. In answer to your original question there are very few drivers I'm aware of that come close to all the benefits of the Lambda drivers. They are a very unique combination of high bandwidth, high efficiency, low distortion, high excursion and high power handling. Many drivers address a few of these issues and come close in some of those areas but not all. The ones that often come up in comparison in terms of low distortion are those by ATC http://www.atc.gb.net/paDriveUnits.htm the audio technology flex units http://www.audiotechnology.dk/iz.asp?id=4\|a\|119\|\|\| Seas excel or exotic line, Scan Speak revelators, TAD 1601's, etc. Most all of these drivers still have much higher inductance, cannot play as high, have lower xmax, higher distortion, and much lower power handling. In reality the reason I first started using the Lambda drivers was because there was nothing else like them. There just isn't a close runner up even at more expense. Comparing to a driver like the selenium isn't much of a comparison. The Selenium has a 4" coil but uses a kapton former and thin top plate. The 2" diameter coil in the Lambda has much more heat sinking area and as a result will have lower power compression and much better power handling. The 4" coil has much higher inductance and with no shorting rings both inductance non-linearity with excursion and flux modulation will create huge amounts of distortion vs a driver that properly addresses these issues. John

9th May 2009, 10:12 PM	#10
Brett diyAudio Member Join Date: Jan 2002	No argument from me John. As you know I already have 8 of your drivers and am very impressed by them. I also have another design on paper that I'm looking forward to trying later that will definitely incorporate a TD12X and possibly an AV15, but the silver cone messes with the aesthetics I'm hoping for. Any ETA on the 6.5?