Recommended woofers/mids for punchy yet deep bass?

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Hi;
I would like to build medium sized bass reflex speakers.
I would like to have a bass sound which is "punchy" (vs. muddy) yet deep.

Which drivers would you recommend in the price range of up to $150 per element?

Which parameters need I look for in those drivers?

Thanks in advance

 

[GregKramer]

Hello,

The question is a bit to open ended to get many responses. First would be what size of box. Medium is different to everyone. Is it a two way or a 3 way? What do you mean by deep, understanding that deep and efficiency will be a trade off? Finally punchy usually describes a response rise in the 70Hz area, are you sure this is what you would like?

Best regards,
Greg

 

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Greg
Thanks for guiding me. I will try to be more precise.
I would like to build speakers are three way. Have total volume of ~100liter or ~25gallons. Dimensions are around 20x120x40cm 7.8x47x15.7 inch (WxHxD)
Woofers are planned to be mounted on the side.

Regarding your comment regarding 70Hz. It a good and interesting one. I meant that I would like the speakers to sound fast and dynamic. I did not know that a peak in 70Hz sounds like that. I however prefer flat response.

 

[ttan98]

I am using is Usher 8945 7" woofer, it gives me very good bass. You can get the data and buy the driver from PE.

Cost per woofer is about $120.

 

[GregKramer]

Hello,

That is a nice size cabinet! More then most people would consider medium It is very narrow for that much volume. Luckily there is an existing design that is very close to what you need.

The Dynamic 4Ts from Clearwave Loudspeakers. They use 4 Dayton RS180s. These are just over 40 each so very close to your price range. The best thing is they already have an excellent crossover that is part of the kit.
http://clearwaveloudspeaker.googlepages.com/

I am sure if you built these you would not be disappointed. I am considering them for myself!

Best of Luck,
Greg

 

[mcmahon48]

here are some reall good choices

http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=264-865
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=150&products_id=842
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1654

or if you are brave and daring you could go my way which are similar to the above posted website
2 x http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=150&products_id=843

1 x http://www.parts-express.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?Partnumber=264-555

1xhttp://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=153&products_id=1078
or
1 x http://cgi.ebay.com/BOSE-tweeters-3...717708&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72:1234|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A1318|301%3A0|293%3A1|294%3A50

 

[mcmahon48]

some info on my design

mtm
m/w box vol each .25 to .28 cubic feet
plus you can have madisound design the box and the crossover
should you use
silverflutes
Vifa xt25
or
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/PDF/DQ25SC05-04.pdf
or if you want to do it youself
cross over at 3khz using a LR2
http://ccs.exl.info/calc_cr.html#second and tweak it
it will be inexpensive and very smooth with good stereo imaging

 

[xenu]

Thank you all for your help and suggestions

I appropriate your time.

 

[xenu]

Re: some info on my design

mtm
m/w box vol each .25 to .28 cubic feet

Could you please explain the above two lines?
I admit I have no clue what they mean. Sorry, I'm new at that.

Thanks

 

[mcmahon48]

simple m/w = mid woofer 4" to 6.5' speakers

each open back woofer speaker requires a certain size box volume to perform at its best and also with tubes port or just ports
if you look at the speaker specs for the silver flutes they got the best response with a box volume around 7 liters (.25 cubic feet +/- 5%) then you may wish to add different sound absorbing foam inside the box
you dont just throw a bunch of speakers onto a box
speakers are just like people in a choir each has their strengths and weakness, how loud, how soft, what frequencies able to reproduce, go to
each speakers has it own separate box to optimize the speaker frequency response
tweeter usually have a sealed back
High qts number usually means it will require a ported reflex bass a large box that has a tube cut to a certain length to get the most useful bass response
low qts usually is better in a sealed box design
get a book on speaker building
http://www.diyaudioandvideo.com/FAQ/XOver/
http://www.zaphaudio.com/

 

[mcmahon48]

MTM = Midwoofer Tweeter Midwoofer design

http://users.d-web.com/dbrown/speakers/speakers.htm

 

[tinitus]

http://www.geocities.com/cc00541/index.html

Statement or Mini Statement should have plenty

Personally I would like to build the smaller and later design, Statement Monitor
Unfortunately we cant find the 4ohm Dayton in EU, only the 8ohm
But some of the Daytons have become available lately, just not the one I need here


This site is also worth a look

http://www.troelsgravesen.dk/Diy_Loudspeaker_Projects.htm


I dont say they are perfect, but its a high level of quality many wont achieve in a million years

 

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Re: simple m/w = mid woofer 4" to 6.5' speakers

you dont just throw a bunch of speakers onto a box
speakers are just like people in a choir each has their strengths and weakness, how loud, how soft, what frequencies able to reproduce, go to each speakers has it own separate box to optimize the speaker frequency responsetweeter usually have a sealed back High qts number usually means it will require a ported reflex bass a large box that has a tube cut to a certain length to get the most useful bass response low qts usually is better in a sealed box design get a book on speaker building

Hi;
Again, thanks for the right-to-the-point tips. My problem is that what the books do not tell you is how to choose drivers. The thing is that buying drivers (especially on line) is almost impossible. Mere numbers would not tell you how this driver would sound (even if you build it with optimal cabinet) This why I tried to ask the experience of other who built their speakers and thus have perspective.

 

[tinitus]

Re: Re: simple m/w = mid woofer 4" to 6.5' speakers

This why I tried to ask the experience of other who built their speakers and thus have perspective.

You have done the right thing, to ask first
Some buy first and ask later

Theres a lot to learn from experienced people
Its just not something that goes with a few lines here and there
With experience there also comes a lot of not so obvious information
Its nestled in the brain, and even if you use it you may not even know how or why
Only experienced people are able to understand how complicated it really is
Much too many variables that makes it impossible to explain in a few words
A good book surely helps, but it wont put you in the position of pulling it off anyway
Sure, its very helpful to know a few facts, and stay clear of the worst hurdles
But basicly its learning by doing
To carefully study the design details of skilled people may be the most effective way
But again, you will need to know what to look at

Those who know how to, are really becoming serious professional amateurs, some even better than many commercial pros

Sorry if I sound rough, but if it could be explained so easily, why would they spend significant part of their life to learn themselves

Buy a couple of cheap, but proven drivers, fore a small 2way, and have your fun with that
Try various xo designs
Study
That may teach you a lot about what happens, when doing this and that
But it only happens if you can make it work properly, fore real
Maybe have it measured, and you will most likely see that it looks bloddy awful

But there are many things to learn, just alone about actually building and assembling a speaker
Things you also learn by building proven designs
But man, even to rekognise a good design takes practice and experience

I better stop, as I dont seem to makes things any easier

Have fun with some drivers
But please, consider to build a properly designed speaker, so that you at least will like listening to music
That may not happen any other way

Now Im finished

 

[mcmahon48]

other things needed

a good lap top or desk top computer
speaker work shop program (free)
crossover designer 6.0 (Free)

crossover simulator (Free)
a very good soundcard
and a good spectrum analyzer program (might be found for free or inexpensive 40$
build a test jig very inexpensive
WWW.virtins.com
and download a acoustical electronics glossary
you can still get great sounding speakers and not have to use the latest and greatest components for the are so many things that affect the sound and most of the cost is the trial and error stages of building a great sounding speaker
so making jigs that have movable but sealible compartments is a plus.