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Old 11th August 2011, 04:06 PM   #91
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dirkwright View Post
... there is probably at least some diffraction going on off of other sharp corners in the room, like cabinet and TV edges. I kind of think it would be very minor, or I'd have to have ears of pure gold to hear it.
In my expereince this is not true.

As I stated before I have gone to extremes to minimize reflections and diffraction of all kinds close to the speakers. The imaging that I achieve is widely held as the best that anyone has heard. It is not subtle, but there are lots of aspects to the problem. You won't hear room diffraction unless the speakers have none. But if the speakers are meticulous about controlling this problem then nearby objects in the room become the next problem (been there).

My "TV" is a screen that is acoustically transparent held in place by "almost nothing" - there is almost no diffraction at all in my design. By comparison a large screen TV would have significant reflection/diffraction. Basically in the entire 4 to 5 feet of the front of my room the only source of sound is the direct sound from the speakers - no back wall reflections, no nearby diffractions, no nothing. This attention to detail pays big dividends when it comes to imaging.

Hard to do? Of course it is!! Worth it? Only if you really want the very best sound possible, otherwise don't bother.
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Old 11th August 2011, 04:09 PM   #92
Pano is offline Pano  United States
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But it can be very hard to see in measurements.
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Old 11th August 2011, 04:20 PM   #93
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Originally Posted by Pano View Post
But it can be very hard to see in measurements.
Maybe, maybe not. I mean you DO have to look for it and most setups have such poor impulse responses that it is hard to see anything, but I don't believe that it should be all that hard to find if you look for it. I just haven't actually tried - who has time!

People have asked to see impulse response measurements of my room - GREAT IDEA!! I just haven't had the time. Would love to do that sometime though.
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Old 11th August 2011, 04:22 PM   #94
DrDyna is offline DrDyna  United States
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Originally Posted by gedlee View Post
In my expereince this is not true.

As I stated before I have gone to extremes to minimize reflections and diffraction of all kinds close to the speakers. The imaging that I achieve is widely held as the best that anyone has heard. It is not subtle, but there are lots of aspects to the problem. You won't hear room diffraction unless the speakers have none. But if the speakers are meticulous about controlling this problem then nearby objects in the room become the next problem (been there).

My "TV" is a screen that is acoustically transparent held in place by "almost nothing" - there is almost no diffraction at all in my design. By comparison a large screen TV would have significant reflection/diffraction. Basically in the entire 4 to 5 feet of the front of my room the only source of sound is the direct sound from the speakers - no back wall reflections, no nearby diffractions, no nothing. This attention to detail pays big dividends when it comes to imaging.

Hard to do? Of course it is!! Worth it? Only if you really want the very best sound possible, otherwise don't bother.
Oh man, this whole discussion is starting to remind me of the argument I had with she who must be obeyed when we moved into this place. It's very hard to explain to someone who owns a Bose wave radio why a couch arm can't be poking out in front of a speaker.
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Old 11th August 2011, 04:47 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by Pano View Post
Yes. CARA. I use it and it's very nice. The more detail you feed it, the better the simulation - and the longer the calculation times.

Your corner set-up looks wide to me. I'd be afraid of the "hole in the middle" effect.
Hey thanks for that!

Yeah, I don't really have a great listening space in this house.
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Old 11th August 2011, 04:48 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by gedlee View Post
In my expereince this is not true.

As I stated before I have gone to extremes to minimize reflections and diffraction of all kinds close to the speakers. The imaging that I achieve is widely held as the best that anyone has heard. It is not subtle, but there are lots of aspects to the problem. You won't hear room diffraction unless the speakers have none. But if the speakers are meticulous about controlling this problem then nearby objects in the room become the next problem (been there).

My "TV" is a screen that is acoustically transparent held in place by "almost nothing" - there is almost no diffraction at all in my design. By comparison a large screen TV would have significant reflection/diffraction. Basically in the entire 4 to 5 feet of the front of my room the only source of sound is the direct sound from the speakers - no back wall reflections, no nearby diffractions, no nothing. This attention to detail pays big dividends when it comes to imaging.

Hard to do? Of course it is!! Worth it? Only if you really want the very best sound possible, otherwise don't bother.
Jeez, I wonder what this room looks like? Martha Stewart would probably faint....
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Old 11th August 2011, 05:26 PM   #97
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Originally Posted by DrDyna View Post
Oh man, this whole discussion is starting to remind me of the argument I had with she who must be obeyed when we moved into this place. It's very hard to explain to someone who owns a Bose wave radio why a couch arm can't be poking out in front of a speaker.
Thats why I preach a "sound room". Give your wife the "living room"! As long as you get a room as well. You'll never get a decent system compromising over spaces where the wife lives.

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Jeez, I wonder what this room looks like? Martha Stewart would probably faint....
If you walk into my theater and even pay the slightest attention to how it looks then you are completely missing the point. The lights go on when I enter, then off for everything else, then back on to leave. Otherwise the room is dark - thats best for listening and for watching movies. This room is by far everyones favorite room in the house. Its all about "entertainment".
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Old 11th August 2011, 05:29 PM   #98
DrDyna is offline DrDyna  United States
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Originally Posted by gedlee View Post
Thats why I preach a "sound room". Give your wife the "living room"! As long as you get a room as well. You'll never get a decent system compromising over spaces where the wife lives.
Yeah, the eventuality is that I'll build an addition to my own specifications once we find our dream house to purchase. I've been planning it for years and it's going to be fantastic once I get to make it happen.
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Old 11th August 2011, 05:33 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by gedlee View Post
Thats why I preach a "sound room". Give your wife the "living room"! As long as you get a room as well. You'll never get a decent system compromising over spaces where the wife lives.

If you walk into my theater and even pay the slightest attention to how it looks then you are completely missing the point. The lights go on when I enter, then off for everything else, then back on to leave. Otherwise the room is dark - thats best for listening and for watching movies. This room is by far everyones favorite room in the house. Its all about "entertainment".
Uh, yeah, not really practical unless a lot of money is available. Particularly if you live in Europe, where living space is very expensive. I think most of us have to make due with major compromises.
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Old 11th August 2011, 06:46 PM   #100
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Its not really that expensive, but it does take a bit of room. More than feasible here in North America, but not Europe. But the question of the thread is "How do I get good imaging?" not "How do I get good imaging when I have to compromise everything?" I can answer the first, but not the second.
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