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Old 2nd October 2008, 04:37 AM   #1
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Default audax 5.25" carbon fiber, experience ?

I've been looking at the audax 5.25" carbon fiber, the hm130c0.

From what I can tell and find online, it is almost the same driver as used in the von schweikert vr-6, except the rubber surround in the stock driver causes a resonance just below 5khz.

http://images.google.com/imgres?imgu...%3Den%26sa%3DN

I'm not an mtm fan, I'm more of a full range driver fan, but tolerate a time alignment setup. I'm thinking of a tweet 2-5khz.
I'll run them like as in the vr-6, 1 over the other wired in parallel for a 4ohm load.

I've read that the driver is detailed and much better than the aerogel stuff. The detail was comparable to an electrostat (sounds good to me).

I'm looking for upper midrange detail and I think this will work.

I'l run bass under it crossed 100-200hz maybe at 24db.


What are your thoughts / impressions of this driver ?

Norman
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Old 2nd October 2008, 05:32 AM   #2
Toaster is offline Toaster  United Kingdom
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It's a good driver. A running prototype I'm designing for a friend uses two in the way you suggest with an Aurum Cantus G1 ribbon tweeter above and a Peerless XLS12 below. Evaluation is ongoing in an active system with a commercial crossover that allows crossover frequencies to be changed easily. A few observations based on our experience: The 130 is pretty flat in actual boxes with little need for diffraction compensation, although in our setup there is a slight 'step' in the response at around 300-400Hz. One a side seems to sound a bit cleaner than two a side. I suspect that (ignoring the XLS for the moment) a '2.5' configuration would work well, bringing in the second driver to fill in the slight 'step' but leaving one driver to run up to the tweeter. Lack of additional matching amplifier channels has prevented us from trying this so far. Power handling is quite good, but they are not powerhouses. Changing the HP crossover from 100Hz to 200 or even 300Hz naturally improves power handling, but also cleans up the sound somewhat with one driver. The sound is certainly good, but I doubt they are '...much better than the Aerogel stuff'; the HMxxxZx series are highly regarded by builders here and elsewhere. We also have a pair of HM100Z0s to try in the near future, but these have to be crossed over significantly higher, necessitating a four-way system and a bass unit other than the XLS 12- or at least a different box to our subwoofer implementation. My understanding is that although some vendors still have these in stock, production ceased some time ago, which has implications for the longevity of your design.
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Old 2nd October 2008, 11:47 AM   #3
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"One a side seems to sound a bit cleaner than two a side."

I figure crossing at 5khz, you'd better be exactly the right height up / down. But crossing at 2-3khz should give a little more leeway.

I'd read a review saying dual mids in a vr (something) had cleaner mids than a single (something) with one 5.25".

For my needs, a 6.5" of area is needed crossed 24db at 200hz.
Dual 5.25's is about equivalent to a 7" but cleaner.
300hz would be cleaner but to my ears 200hz kept the voice in the mid driver.

It'll be up to what tweeter for where to cross.

Where is your friend crossing the cantus at and what slope ?
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Old 2nd October 2008, 11:53 AM   #4
AndrewT is offline AndrewT  Scotland
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I bought the World Audio KLS3 gold.
The 130co runs from 400Hz to 6000Hz in that passive crossover design.
It sounds superb.
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regards Andrew T.
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Old 2nd October 2008, 01:33 PM   #5
sreten is offline sreten  United Kingdom
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Hi,

With a low c/o point to bass you might as well 0.5 way the mids.

/sreten.
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Old 2nd October 2008, 06:03 PM   #6
Toaster is offline Toaster  United Kingdom
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Certainly you'd expect any inter-driver phase combing to be less of an issue (or at least less sensitive to the exact listening axis as you say) as the LP frequency to the mid drops down. There's more than one mechanism involved with the two vs one midrange-a- side question of course; using two will obviously reduce excursion for a given loudness which is beneficial. Similarly, as I'm sure you realise, area is not the only factor when considering maximum/ desired output levels- excursion and power handling can vary quite a bit even among high quality drivers.
Just a single HM130 works fine with a 200Hz 4th order xo, but of course it's a tradeoff in terms of power handling and LF extension as always. As Sreten suggests, a '0.5' configuration gives the best of both worlds with additional output/ power handling where it does the most good, while also allowing diffraction compensation to be achieved easily if required and avoiding combing effects.
The handover to the tweeter in the prototype system is 4th order (24dB/ octave), but the frequency has been anything from 1.8kHz up to as high as 4kHz as we experiment. Lower is generally better if the tweeter is up to it, to avoid midrange beaming and the resultant response dip off axis- which can affect imaging and alter the perception of the tonal balance, even if the on-axis response is flat. It's nice to hear as much of the ribbon as possible, but the G1 can sound a bit stressed on some music if the crossover frequency is low. Another tradeoff!
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