Hiya,
Newbie here and I wanted to get some thoughts on my first DIY horn project (thinking I might be biting off more than I can chew). The idea is to revive the Onken design of the 80s. So it's going to use the classic configuration:
Altec 414 in Onken cabinet
Onken 500 in LeCleach horn (550 Azurahorn)
JBL 2405
Was thinking of sticking to the recommended cross-over points of 800 Hz and 8000Hz, 2nd order Butterworth slope...
Any comments appreciated! I'm no techie...
Rgds,
JJ
Newbie here and I wanted to get some thoughts on my first DIY horn project (thinking I might be biting off more than I can chew). The idea is to revive the Onken design of the 80s. So it's going to use the classic configuration:
Altec 414 in Onken cabinet
Onken 500 in LeCleach horn (550 Azurahorn)
JBL 2405
Was thinking of sticking to the recommended cross-over points of 800 Hz and 8000Hz, 2nd order Butterworth slope...
Any comments appreciated! I'm no techie...
Rgds,
JJ
Go for it!
There has been a lot written about the Onken box on these pages - but you are not trying unknown drivers, so you should have no problems.
The only tricky part will be the crossover. I remember them all as being 2nd order passive with about the x-over points you mention. Tweaking the x-over slopes and phase will be where the system really comes together.
Have fun with the project - the results will be well worth it.
There has been a lot written about the Onken box on these pages - but you are not trying unknown drivers, so you should have no problems.
The only tricky part will be the crossover. I remember them all as being 2nd order passive with about the x-over points you mention. Tweaking the x-over slopes and phase will be where the system really comes together.
Have fun with the project - the results will be well worth it.
I finished mine about 2 yrs ago and have spent a little time tweaking the X-O design.
Mine used the Iconic 165-8G aka Great Plains Audio 515-8G with JBL 4333 mid horns and 2402 annular ring horn tweeters.
Cross over is at 800Hz and 8kHz and I am very pleased with the results. They are completely competitive with anything I have heard to relatively obscene price levels, and like you I had the distinct feeling I was biting off a bit more than I could chew, but success is its own reward..
My latest X-O design is posted in one of the old Onken threads and works well in my set up, still you might consider designing your own. (This X-O is designed to be driven by an amplifier with an ~3 ohm source impedance.)
Here is that thread: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=78728&highlight=
Here is the thread where my Onkens come to life, there are even pictures:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=78407&perpage=25&highlight=&pagenumber=1
Knowing what I now know and given the many hours of listening pleasure these speakers have given me I would do it all over again in a heartbeat if I had to.
The improved x-o in the other thread cited made a significant improvement in every way. I haven't changed anything else - there hasn't been any need.
Mine used the Iconic 165-8G aka Great Plains Audio 515-8G with JBL 4333 mid horns and 2402 annular ring horn tweeters.
Cross over is at 800Hz and 8kHz and I am very pleased with the results. They are completely competitive with anything I have heard to relatively obscene price levels, and like you I had the distinct feeling I was biting off a bit more than I could chew, but success is its own reward..
My latest X-O design is posted in one of the old Onken threads and works well in my set up, still you might consider designing your own. (This X-O is designed to be driven by an amplifier with an ~3 ohm source impedance.)
Here is that thread: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=78728&highlight=
Here is the thread where my Onkens come to life, there are even pictures:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=78407&perpage=25&highlight=&pagenumber=1
Knowing what I now know and given the many hours of listening pleasure these speakers have given me I would do it all over again in a heartbeat if I had to.
The improved x-o in the other thread cited made a significant improvement in every way. I haven't changed anything else - there hasn't been any need.
And finally the second version of the X-O, note the really large inductor which is in the woofer LF section of the X-O, this was needed to minimize the dcr of the inductor to maintain proper woofer damping and not for power handling..
All of the other inductors are air core and all are from Madisound. The capacitors are Clarity Cap SA type, and represent a lot of performance for the money. (I've tried a number of different caps in this evolving X-O and these are the best so far, good enough that I have no motivation to spend more..)
All of the other inductors are air core and all are from Madisound. The capacitors are Clarity Cap SA type, and represent a lot of performance for the money. (I've tried a number of different caps in this evolving X-O and these are the best so far, good enough that I have no motivation to spend more..)
Attachments
panomaniac said:
Hi Mike,
Much appreciated, the X-O is a little more cramped than I would like, but it was originally intended as a temporary solution. (It looks better in person, I somehow managed to find the worst angle.. LOL
The first version built on this platform while not perfect was good enough to convince me that I was on the right track. This version sounds better still as it behaves much better in the cross-over region than the original and has better caps and the bass alignment is much improved with the new X-O design and the lower inductor dcr.
The system frankly looks amateurish/proto-typish, but oddly enough because it is so obvious that I made it I get many more positive comments about the speaker system than I do about almost anything else. (My homebrew dac and cd transport is running neck in neck.)
Thanks... only got back from a short holiday and was pleasantly surprised by your pics! Slowly getting all the various bits together, cabinets, horn, adaptor etc so it will take a while... I'll post updates here as I go along. Very keen to hear the Onken 500 on the Le Cleac'h and I'll probably get a Fc 450 Hz (thanks Lyn Olsen) one now to cross-over at 800 Hz.
JJ
JJ
I've reread your cross-over thread and am finding myself going through the same process. I've also decided to cross over at 800Hz and 8000Hz, 2nd order Butterworth.
I've used a simple online calculator to get the values:
http://www.diyaudioandvideo.com/Calculator/XOver/
Still a long way to go... but some pics first
With adaptor as it's a screw one mount
Cheers.
JJ
I've used a simple online calculator to get the values:
http://www.diyaudioandvideo.com/Calculator/XOver/
Still a long way to go... but some pics first
With adaptor as it's a screw one mount
Cheers.
JJ
JJ,
How are coming about on your project.
I am planning on doing the same build, with a Altec 414, 802's, and a 811 horn.....just gotta get the horns and have the 414/drivers to GPA for remagging ,cone, and diaphram replacement....
Good luck and looking forward to your progress in your project.
-chris
How are coming about on your project.
I am planning on doing the same build, with a Altec 414, 802's, and a 811 horn.....just gotta get the horns and have the 414/drivers to GPA for remagging ,cone, and diaphram replacement....
Good luck and looking forward to your progress in your project.
-chris
I know how it goes jonjin...
I am anticipating a move here in the few months and I might postpone my build till after spring. But, I think I might get started , so when I move in, I will have some decent tunes to listen to while unpacking....
Good luck to you jon...
Sorry for going slightly OT
Carl, nice to see you too....
I started posting here a while back when the bib's were a pretty hot thing, and for what they were and little cost lay -out were not to bad.
I also haunt the AA as well, it broke my online audio cherry back in 2001, but i waited 2 years to post my 1st message, lol!
The 414's have not arrived yet, and I am not sure of when, but I am patient though, as I have a good bit of side work to do, mainly getting some more insulation up in the attic.
I have been monitoring ebay on horns, so I will try and figure out a median price is for a pair, with shipping.
Cya.....
-chris
I am anticipating a move here in the few months and I might postpone my build till after spring. But, I think I might get started , so when I move in, I will have some decent tunes to listen to while unpacking....
Good luck to you jon...
Sorry for going slightly OT
Carl, nice to see you too....
I started posting here a while back when the bib's were a pretty hot thing, and for what they were and little cost lay -out were not to bad.
I also haunt the AA as well, it broke my online audio cherry back in 2001, but i waited 2 years to post my 1st message, lol!
The 414's have not arrived yet, and I am not sure of when, but I am patient though, as I have a good bit of side work to do, mainly getting some more insulation up in the attic.
I have been monitoring ebay on horns, so I will try and figure out a median price is for a pair, with shipping.
Cya.....
-chris
The Azurahorns arrived yesterday. Thanks Martin! They are truly a work of art. I can see why they are so well regarded. Initial listening impressions show they are very open, without that 'honkiness'.
I've also managed to get my hands on an Altec N-800 cross-over so for now my cross-over problems are solved. Interestingly, the caps in them did not match my calculations using 16ohms, 800 Hz second order Butterworth. My value was 8.8 uF and the one in the Altec was 10.5 uF.
JJ
I've also managed to get my hands on an Altec N-800 cross-over so for now my cross-over problems are solved. Interestingly, the caps in them did not match my calculations using 16ohms, 800 Hz second order Butterworth. My value was 8.8 uF and the one in the Altec was 10.5 uF.
JJ
Attachments
Very nice! I've seen the website, but your photo is even more impressive.
Crikey! Is the CD motor holding the horn up? I don't see any other means of support. The horn must be a lot lighter than it looks.
As for the crossover, the cap value is not that far off. Textbook values often are not the best when the real respose and impedance curves are taken into account.
E.G., my Altec 806 CD on the 811 horn tend to run a bit lower than 16R, especially down toward the low end. YMMV
Crikey! Is the CD motor holding the horn up? I don't see any other means of support. The horn must be a lot lighter than it looks.
As for the crossover, the cap value is not that far off. Textbook values often are not the best when the real respose and impedance curves are taken into account.
E.G., my Altec 806 CD on the 811 horn tend to run a bit lower than 16R, especially down toward the low end. YMMV
- Status
- This old topic is closed. If you want to reopen this topic, contact a moderator using the "Report Post" button.