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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 31st July 2008, 11:16 PM   #81
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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I offered Marcus his money back. He declined. Apparantly he's not that disappointed.
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Old 31st July 2008, 11:24 PM   #82
Salas is offline Salas  Greece
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Quote:
Originally posted by gedlee

Certainly not reality.
See what they can currently do, and the prices. Curved ready made cabinets with instant volume world shipping. Having electronic crossover parts on assembled pcb's they can even offer ''audiophile'' component grade options, kit subwoofers, plate amps, subwoofer cabinets, imagine a complete HT kit system approved by you with set up guide, etc. What, they will not negotiate with B&C? They carry them already.
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Old 31st July 2008, 11:31 PM   #83
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Premade cabinets from China - almost free. You just have to buy 100 of them at a time.

If you look at my pricing you will see that I charge only $100 for all the cabinet wood and small parts etc. The cost of my kits IS NOT in the enclosure.
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Old 31st July 2008, 11:36 PM   #84
Salas is offline Salas  Greece
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They claim they are US made, but that is besides the point. My idea is to adopt parts of their policy or use partners like them as an outlet for scaling up availability and hassle free sales.
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Old 1st August 2008, 12:25 AM   #85
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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They could be US made at that price for an empty cabinet. Its not hard to do.

But there are things about doing business in the US that may be different than where you live. There is no business model for what I am doing with a company like Parts Express. They have far too much overhead and markup. The speakers would end up being twice as expensive and then there is no market for them. The US is volume, volume, volume and to do that you have to be commodity priced which is why there isn't any real high end stuff at Parts Express.

When I published my book no one would handle it because their markups were too high. Amazon marks up 60%, the lowest is 40%. You just can't sell to those outlets unless you can accept a 15-20% margin and unless the volume is enormous thats not a viable business for me.

The whole field is a catch-22 fixated on the median quality and price. Any consumer who wants to break out into the hi-end of quality is looking at huge price increase as a result of this situation. I am trying to break that mold by what I am doing. You can agree or diagree, accept it or not, but you won't find a speaker like I am selling at the price that I am selling at anywhere. Its just won't happen.
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Old 1st August 2008, 12:28 AM   #86
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Quote:
Originally posted by gedlee If you look at my pricing you will see that I charge only $100 for all the cabinet wood and small parts etc. The cost of my kits IS NOT in the enclosure.
Why exactly $100?

$40 Crossover (Madisound)
$120 B&C DE250-8 (http://www.prosoundservice.com/m9_vi...em=B%26C-DE250)
$140 B&C 10PS26-8 (http://www.prosoundservice.com/m9_vi...m=B%26C-10PS26)

= $300 (one speaker)

But why are you constantly arguing about the price? Nobody complained. From my perspective the kit is a good value. But you didn't cut as precise as your tools allow you to. And obviously you made a mistake when cutting the parts for my kit. What's so hard in admitting that?

Best, Markus
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Old 1st August 2008, 12:49 AM   #87
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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I did admit that from your discription there may have been a problem in your parts that wasn't in mine.

What you were posting as a problem with the top panel was NOT a problem IMO. Thats is the way it is intended to fit. It has to be sanded smooth AFTER assembly. Thats the way I do it and the only way that I can see it being cost effective to do in a kit. If you look at the attached drawing you will see that the radius prevents a "good fit" unless the side panel is radius'd too,which is impractical, and unnecessary because the excess is easily sanded off.

Had the top piece been 1" then this would not happen, but 1" MDF is not readily accesable to me.

The baffle, foam plug and mounting plate makes up the other $200. Thats where the engineering, the Intellectual Property and where the vast majority of the labor are.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf corner2.pdf (12.7 KB, 144 views)
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Old 1st August 2008, 01:08 AM   #88
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Earl,

obviously we talk past each other. Towards the front the situation looks like this:

Click the image to open in full size.

I'll post a picture tomorrow.

Best, Markus
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Old 1st August 2008, 02:48 AM   #89
gedlee is offline gedlee  United States
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Then you should push up the side panel to mate with the top (as I suggested before) and take up this error at the bottom, not at the top. I am surprised that there is this much error in that dimension. That I have not seen before.

See my drawing;

Are you saying that the bottom would look like this if you made the top fit correctly? I need to figure out what dimension is wrong and check that on future parts.


Attached Files
File Type: pdf cornerbottom.pdf (10.7 KB, 157 views)
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Old 1st August 2008, 02:59 AM   #90
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Markus,

To have that 1 inch radius put into the 3/4 stock and have it cut into both pieces would require either the box assembled while cutting or the pieces seperately CNC machined with a special custom made cutter. Since the radius on the side baffle is not a common arc or cutter size. Having this done CNC would be nice but the start up cost for this would be 15,000-20,000 bucks and would only become cost effective if many kits were sold. Also, the special custom made cutter would become dull over a short time and would require new tooling to be made periodically which would be too expensive. The alternative of having the mill use a standard cutter to interpolate the arc is the best solution but then increases the engineering start up costs and increases the time to cut each piece. And requires an expensive five axis mill or table router which would drive the cost of CNC machining up too high for small production runs.

This is probably not realistic. And since the boards are cut by hand the tolerances are not high enough to do it in advance and the radius would not be aligned properly. However, since the boards are cut by hand you can expect that there will be a few parts which are kind of way off. It looks like you have got a side wall that was cut too far off the correct size. The simplest solution is to re-cut another board the correct size or to take up the gap at the back of the cabinet were it will not show as much or to ask them to send you another side wall that is closer to nominal size.
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