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Old 9th May 2013, 02:40 AM   #2391
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kjeldsen View Post
I also prefer accuracy, but that is not isolated to front firing speakers but rather describes a speaker without phase distortion. I have absolutely no hall effect when playing with upfiring speakers. I do prefer them a bit tilted towards the listening spot though.
How can you possibly get accuracy when your speaker system has such a different presentation than a front firing speaker(which all mix and mastering studios have)? You are going to have far more reflections than a front firing speaker has. The dispersion angle is completely different (horizontal versus vertical). Based on that alone, accuracy is thrown out the window when compared to the reference mixing and mastering speakers. You are now favoring an "effect" over accuracy at this point.

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I'm sure this is also about preferences, and I don't favour speakers with narrow sweatspots like B&W nautilus series, I'd rather listen to Dali Euphonia with much better (better in my world) dispersion. The Nautilus needs a lot toe in, the Dali needs no toe in at all.
It is no secret that a lot of studios use the B&W 801 Nautilus speakers in their mixing and mastering rooms. That is because they are very accurate unforgiving speakers. Audio engineers need to hear everything in the recording, not a lot of uncontrolled reflections floating around the room.
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Old 9th May 2013, 03:14 AM   #2392
ScottG is offline ScottG  United States
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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post



It is no secret that a lot of studios use the B&W 801 Nautilus speakers in their mixing and mastering rooms. That is because they are very accurate unforgiving speakers.

Audio engineers need to hear everything in the recording, not a lot of uncontrolled reflections floating around the room.

Though an older version the measured performance is similar (at least with respect to polars):

See figure 6:

B&W Nautilus 801 loudspeaker Measurements part 2 | Stereophile.com

Except at 2.2 kHz and above 8 khz, it's not what you would call a "directional loudspeaker" (..of course most aren't).

As to the room treatment and reflections, the worst is the console itself. (..or desk and monitor). Usually a lot worse than what most casual listener's deal with (..with respect to sound above the modal region).
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Old 9th May 2013, 06:28 AM   #2393
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
Prove it.
look at the scheme - there is no first order reflection in the direction of the listener


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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
Correct.
You must be kidding


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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
It says carpet, not carpet with pad underneath. So no it does not. It does not mention popcorn ceilings, so no it does not. Another failed example here.
it's just an example, You want a bigger chart? No problem:

http://www.wsdg.com/dynamic.asp?id=r...ogy/absorbtion



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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
I am wondering as well.

...
Again, so am I.
I am searching the book and I can't find anything like You say it's there. Where is it?



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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
If you don't know what it means by now, quit this discussion immediately.
evasive answer, whay should I quit? Because You don't know how to answer to my question?
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Last edited by graaf; 9th May 2013 at 06:31 AM.
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Old 9th May 2013, 06:45 AM   #2394
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
Yes, I am completely sure.
ok, thank You


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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
There was no name. They were designed and built by a very close friend and very famous Hollywood studio speaker designer and builder(His designs are in a majority of post houses here, and quite a few of the large studios as well). I do know one used a Tannoy coaxial driver, and the other two had separate tweeters and mid/bass drivers. They looked just like the examples a couple of pages ago, but with a different cabinet color.
quite a fascinating story, so a very famous professional (=busy, serious, rich) had built Himself (in His garage?) three cheap examples of obviously unusable Boseish "effect speaker" and then brought all three pairs to Your place for You to listen to them?

When was it?
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Old 9th May 2013, 07:27 AM   #2395
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Originally Posted by graaf View Post
look at the scheme - there is no first order reflection in the direction of the listener
Once again, that scheme is not representative of a typical room here. Too many variables for you to use that as an example. Not buying it.




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You must be kidding
No.......




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it's just an example, You want a bigger chart? No problem:

WSDG - Absorption Coefficient Chart
And still no combinations.





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I am searching the book and I can't find anything like You say it's there. Where is it?
Keep looking.....





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evasive answer, whay should I quit? Because You don't know how to answer to my question?
Your question was as lame as some of your theories. I am not surprised that you don't seem to "get it".
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Old 9th May 2013, 07:28 AM   #2396
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
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Originally Posted by weltersys View Post
a diffusive "popcorn" finish is preferred by many in this region.
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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
diffusive "popcorn" ceilings.
pros' opinions on gearslutz on absorption coefficients of "popcorn" ceiling
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Old 9th May 2013, 07:37 AM   #2397
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Originally Posted by graaf View Post
ok, thank You
Right....




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quite a fascinating story, so a very famous professional (=busy, serious, rich) had built Himself (in His garage?) three cheap examples of obviously unusable Boseish "effect speaker" and then brought all three pairs to Your place for You to listen to them?

When was it?
Your story is equally fascinating. However, your imagination in this case is a little ambition-less, amateurish, and a little hokey. He does not work out of his garage, he has a medium size factory. He does not consider himself famous and he is not rich but doing very well for himself. You cannot say ANYTHING is cheap until you have actually seen it, blind guesses are about as helpful as fleas. I listened to all three "Boseish" speakers in one of the listening rooms in his factory. I hated the sound so much I would not have even bothered to bring them home. I would consider the design unusable, not just his speakers.
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Old 9th May 2013, 07:48 AM   #2398
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
Here in the states, wall to wall carpeting rules,
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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
It says carpet, not carpet with pad underneath.
am I to understand that in the States "wall to wall carpeting" "with pad underneath" "rules"?
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Old 9th May 2013, 08:04 AM   #2399
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
He does not consider himself famous and he is not rich but doing very well for himself.
You called him "very famous", and by rich I understand just that "doing very well for himself", nothing more.

And surely He's is busy. And a professional.

Then I wonder why He ever wasted His time to build something like that, three attempts at something that another professional considers "an unusable design" and for seemingly obvious reasons??

And then He would present all those three "excercises in ignorance" to His professional guests "in one of the listening rooms in his factory"???

Was it a kind of a difficult time for Him? A sort of a momentary lapse of reason?

very puzzling
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Last edited by graaf; 9th May 2013 at 08:30 AM.
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Old 9th May 2013, 08:24 AM   #2400
graaf is offline graaf  Poland
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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
Once again, that scheme is not representative of a typical room here.
why not? Are You telling me that a typical room has tilted walls and a sloped ceiling etc.?


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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
Keep looking.....
I know the book, what You say isn't there.

Chapter 9 "The Effects of Reflections on Sound Quality/Timbre",
paragraph 9.1 "The Audibility of Acoustical Interference - Comb Filtering", conclusion: "The upshot is that in any normal room, audible comb filtering is highly improbable" (page 151)

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Originally Posted by Soundtrackmixer View Post
Your question was as lame as some of your theories. I am not surprised that you don't seem to "get it".
please explain, or just link any source where it is defined as You use the term, why not?

it is a discussion forum - no question is lame here, just answers, especially evasive answers from people who present themselves as professionals
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