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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 13th February 2008, 03:53 AM   #11
Ceibal is offline Ceibal  United States
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Default ultimate loudspeakers

What I am looking for is a woofer/tweeter combo that will give me extreme detail while being natural and smooth. I thought maybe the Seas Excel would do that for the woofer, not sure about the tweeter. I am still considering the morel supreme 130. Is there a better tweeter I should consider? Also, what size woofer would be best? I was looking at the 7 inch.

What is the difference between paper and magnesium? Will one provide more bass response/ better detail?
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Old 13th February 2008, 03:53 AM   #12
Ceibal is offline Ceibal  United States
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Default Current System

I thought I would go through and give everyone an idea of what my current system looks like.

Denon avr 2000 (old but still very good) looking to replace soon with Parasound New Classic Series
Front speakers - NHT (Now Hear This) 1.3A book shelf speakers
two NHT 10 inch subs
one 15 inch Earthquake Supernova
one 15 inch Dayton Audio Titanic 1000 watt sub
rears - Earthquake Dipole Platine Noiree's
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Old 13th February 2008, 03:53 AM   #13
Ceibal is offline Ceibal  United States
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Default sealed vs vented

My goal has been to design a sealed design for accuracy. Would the SEAS Excel series work for that purpose?
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Old 13th February 2008, 04:27 AM   #14
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Last night I connected my amplifier to my brand new Scanspeak 18W8531G00 and Dynaudio Esotar T330D in finished MTMWW cabinets. I used a temporary XO designed using simulation software in order to run-in the drivers before doing measurement and both the 18W8531G00 and the T330D sounded beautifully with no audible cone breakup, etc. The simulation was so accurate and I guess the final XO design based on measurement may only get it better for another 5-10% only. The XO point is at 2k with a filter not exactly but close to LR4 with some overlaps and the phase difference is less than 5-10 degree.

The 18W8531G00 is highly recommended. It is obviously better than the 18W8545 I previously worked with. The T330D is no doubt much better than the Seas Millenium I used.
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Old 13th February 2008, 03:13 PM   #15
Bluto is offline Bluto  United States
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Ceibel -

About a year ago I started wanting to build the same thing you discuss .... criteria wise.

After over 1000 hours of study I'm convinced there is no perfect loudspeaker, all is compromise, equipment and choice of music will alter everyones best plans.

These Guy's are right, build a proven design by a respected builder that has received good feedback from experienced builders and who has already worked out the wicked XO problems.

You'll definitely come ahead comparison to buying high end namebrand and save yourself a ton of headaches.

If there's something out there you have heard and must have, wait a year or so until the manufacturer has moved to a new model , patents are no longer an issue and guaranteed you'll see plans for a clone from the DIY Community.

Bluto
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Old 13th February 2008, 03:34 PM   #16
rabbitz is offline rabbitz  Australia
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Quote:
Originally posted by HiFiNutNut
Last night I connected my amplifier to my brand new Scanspeak 18W8531G00 and Dynaudio Esotar T330D in finished MTMWW cabinets.
Did you use the 18W8531G00 for bass or are they part of the MTM component for mids? I only ask as there seems to be varying information on getting quality bass with mids out of them but they are great when you use them for mid or bass duty only.

BTW, I use them in my own OB mains as mids from 160Hz to 2400Hz and they are great. I've had a lot of experience with them but could never get the bass to sound right in a vented enclosure. Sure there was plenty and they went low but something was odd.
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Old 13th February 2008, 08:45 PM   #17
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Rabbitz,

The 8531 is planned to be used as a mid and upper base to cover 150Hz to 2000Hz. Below that I have the 8561. I have not built the active XO yet so the 8531 is being run from 20Hz-2000Hz without EQ in an OB stuffed U-frame, with a simulated XO to cross over to the tweeter, in MTM. This arrangement is for running-in the drivers only before taking acoustic measurement.

It sounds very good indeed. Distortion arises when playing loud bass materials but that will be gone once the 8561 comes into the picture. It is not 100% accurate as I can hear the dipole peak making the music a bit chesty but overall gives a very satisfactory sound. I can imagine how good the system sounds when completed.

I am totally happy with the 8531 used as mid or bass driver. Its bass quality is very surprising (good).

By the way, with the drivers and cabinets I have, in theory the XO point should be at 2kHz (1 wavelength between the tweeter and midrange) and should not be higher. However, I have modelled some gentler asymetrical slops for the two drivers and I believe the XO would sound excellent but with a XO point at 2.6kHz. That is too high in theory. I am not sure if I will try that.

Do you use MTM? how does your 8531 sound with 2.4kHz XO? at what slop?

Regards,
Bill
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Old 13th February 2008, 09:07 PM   #18
Ceibal is offline Ceibal  United States
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I will take the advice and build the xo from someone else's plans but I would like to pick out my own woofers and tweeter combo. What woofers do you recommend as oppossed to seas elite's?

Has anyone build any of the kits at Madisound?
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Old 13th February 2008, 09:59 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ceibal
I will take the advice and build the xo from someone else's plans but I would like to pick out my own woofers and tweeter combo. What woofers do you recommend as oppossed to seas elite's?

Has anyone build any of the kits at Madisound?
I can hear the cries of "Noooo" echo throughout the forum.

This is a really bad idea. If you use an XO from someone else, use the same drivers. If you can't find an XO for the drivers you have chosen then you have no choice but to build your own crossover. You can't chop and change in the matter of drivers and crossovers I'm afraid, they're symbiotic.
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Old 13th February 2008, 10:24 PM   #20
Ceibal is offline Ceibal  United States
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Quote:
Originally posted by ShinOBIWAN


I can hear the cries of "Noooo" echo throughout the forum.

This is a really bad idea. If you use an XO from someone else, use the same drivers. If you can't find an XO for the drivers you have chosen then you have no choice but to build your own crossover. You can't chop and change in the matter of drivers and crossovers I'm afraid, they're symbiotic.

Ok, then is there a good dual woofer design that I could start with? I did not see one from some of the links people have posted or maybe I just missed it.
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