Hello, can anyone suggest some high quality 15" woofers for sealed enclosures? Specifically reproducing between 50hz-200hz in a 6 or less cubic ft sealed enclosure.
I have subs for 20hz-50hz. This will be a 5 way system all sealed hoping to achieve 20-20k flat with 90+ sensitivity. I can spend about $400 USD per woofer. Thanks!!
I have subs for 20hz-50hz. This will be a 5 way system all sealed hoping to achieve 20-20k flat with 90+ sensitivity. I can spend about $400 USD per woofer. Thanks!!
JBL 2225 (recent but obsolete) or 2226(current model). 2225 commonly found second hand, thousands and thousands were made and used for professional applications.
See, for example, http://www.usspeaker.com/JBL 2226h-1.htm
See, for example, http://www.usspeaker.com/JBL 2226h-1.htm
Thanks PigletsDad, the jbl 2226 were the first I looked at, but when I plugged them in winisd they drop like a stone in sealed enclosures. I hope to get something that will stay flat from 50-200hz (within -3db at 50hz). Is what I'm asking for even possible? I will be using EQ to flatten it out a little, but I don't wanted to do any more than +/-3 of EQing on each driver for their assigned frequencies. Thanks a lot
Hawthorne Audio has the augies, but I don't know if they are suitable for sealed? I have the 15" coaxials and love em
http://www.hawthorneaudio.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=19
I know a high Qts makes for a better situation in an open baffle situation, but what will this do in a sealed?
maybe a speaker guru chime in here?
http://www.hawthorneaudio.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=19
I know a high Qts makes for a better situation in an open baffle situation, but what will this do in a sealed?
maybe a speaker guru chime in here?
TD15's
I would suggest a TD15 - a design which was originally developed by Lambda Acoustics. I have a pair in 3.5 ft^3 sealed enclosures for my dedicated 2-channel system. They are equalized to flat (in-room) at the low-end and rolled off at ~350Hz, 4th order. They have a Theil-Small efficiency of ~93 dB.
I understand that Acoustic Elegance is currently manufacturing these drivers, but I have not had any direct contact with them.
Contact information:
http://www.aespeakers.com/
John Janowitz,
Owner Acoustic Elegance LLC
_________________
Acoustic Elegance/AE Speakers
1825 Mills St
Green Bay, WI 54302
phone: (920) 469-9198
I bought my drivers used through private sale, and have an extra pair which I would consider selling. BTW, these drivers (sealed) produce the most natural and musical bass that I have heard.
Best Regards,
Edward
I would suggest a TD15 - a design which was originally developed by Lambda Acoustics. I have a pair in 3.5 ft^3 sealed enclosures for my dedicated 2-channel system. They are equalized to flat (in-room) at the low-end and rolled off at ~350Hz, 4th order. They have a Theil-Small efficiency of ~93 dB.
I understand that Acoustic Elegance is currently manufacturing these drivers, but I have not had any direct contact with them.
Contact information:
http://www.aespeakers.com/
John Janowitz,
Owner Acoustic Elegance LLC
_________________
Acoustic Elegance/AE Speakers
1825 Mills St
Green Bay, WI 54302
phone: (920) 469-9198
I bought my drivers used through private sale, and have an extra pair which I would consider selling. BTW, these drivers (sealed) produce the most natural and musical bass that I have heard.
Best Regards,
Edward
Thanks
Boris_The_Blade- the speakers look good
richie00boy- is the "qts" you mentioned what winisd calls "qtc" in the sealed box calculations?
EdwardWest- thanks for the suggestion and offer, but I'll be needing 4 total...
But guys, i found this at partsexpress, when I plugged it in winisd the SEALED ENCLOSURE graph looked really good! only -2.5db at 50hz (3 cu ft. per speaker) Can someone verify this with another speaker design program? Looks too good to be true.
The Dayton Classic 15" woofer is excellent as a replacement driver or for new system design and construction. The versatile set of parameters makes it suitable for sealed or vented enclosure designs. With impressive bass performance and smooth overall response, it is an excellent choice for any DIY three-way loudspeaker project.
Specifications: *Power handling: 100 watts RMS/150 watts max *VCdia: 2" *Le: 3.20 mH *Impedance: 8 ohms *Re: 6.1 ohms *Frequency range: 20-1,500 Hz *Fs: 20 Hz *SPL: 92.8 dB 2.83V/1m *Vas: 14.00 cu. ft. *Qms: 3.05 *Qes: .33 *Qts: .30 *Xmax: 4.3mm *Dimensions: A: 15", B: 14", C: 6-3/8"
Boris_The_Blade- the speakers look good
richie00boy- is the "qts" you mentioned what winisd calls "qtc" in the sealed box calculations?
EdwardWest- thanks for the suggestion and offer, but I'll be needing 4 total...
But guys, i found this at partsexpress, when I plugged it in winisd the SEALED ENCLOSURE graph looked really good! only -2.5db at 50hz (3 cu ft. per speaker) Can someone verify this with another speaker design program? Looks too good to be true.
The Dayton Classic 15" woofer is excellent as a replacement driver or for new system design and construction. The versatile set of parameters makes it suitable for sealed or vented enclosure designs. With impressive bass performance and smooth overall response, it is an excellent choice for any DIY three-way loudspeaker project.
Specifications: *Power handling: 100 watts RMS/150 watts max *VCdia: 2" *Le: 3.20 mH *Impedance: 8 ohms *Re: 6.1 ohms *Frequency range: 20-1,500 Hz *Fs: 20 Hz *SPL: 92.8 dB 2.83V/1m *Vas: 14.00 cu. ft. *Qms: 3.05 *Qes: .33 *Qts: .30 *Xmax: 4.3mm *Dimensions: A: 15", B: 14", C: 6-3/8"
I use JBL 2226Hs in 10 ft^3 sealed boxes
I use DSP eq to make them flat from 20Hz - 550Hz. It is more than a 3db correction, but I also do room correction which requires more than 3db anyway. They sound really great, and have incredible power handling, so the EQ is not a big deal for any reasonable volume.
Highly recommended. I'm sure they will do fine in a much smaller box, and I am planning on moving them to a critically damped box (4.5 ft^3).
I use DSP eq to make them flat from 20Hz - 550Hz. It is more than a 3db correction, but I also do room correction which requires more than 3db anyway. They sound really great, and have incredible power handling, so the EQ is not a big deal for any reasonable volume.
Highly recommended. I'm sure they will do fine in a much smaller box, and I am planning on moving them to a critically damped box (4.5 ft^3).
15" sealed box driver options
Look for a Qts of .35 or higher and a Vas of less than 10 cu '.
Usually a driver with a medium sized magnet, large voice coil and a heavy cone with foam/rubber surround.
Ususally best with approx 4 - 6 cu ft for best results.
Eminence used to make some decent models. I have some of them and hoping they are hanging in there with older foam surround.
JBL 2226 is not a good candidate for sealed as the LF rolloff starts too soon. Not bad for ported (4 cu ' tuned to 40hz) with -3db around 50hz in the real world.
Regards, Ron
Look for a Qts of .35 or higher and a Vas of less than 10 cu '.
Usually a driver with a medium sized magnet, large voice coil and a heavy cone with foam/rubber surround.
Ususally best with approx 4 - 6 cu ft for best results.
Eminence used to make some decent models. I have some of them and hoping they are hanging in there with older foam surround.
JBL 2226 is not a good candidate for sealed as the LF rolloff starts too soon. Not bad for ported (4 cu ' tuned to 40hz) with -3db around 50hz in the real world.
Regards, Ron
KCCT82 said:
Looking at the specification and the response plots, these will give you an F3 of ~50. Four of these things in any kind of domestic setting can pound the hell out of you. Although no more than two Lambda TD15's which have twice the Xmax and power handling.
Although these will produce very high output from 50 to 200Hz, I don't believe that the sound quality will be all that good. They have a high Le, which in my experience negatively impact the sound quality.
Edward
Eminence Definimax comes pretty close or some of the Selenium might work...still, the Usher is abargain and may have the better upper FR response, probably due to a flatter/shallow cone
You know, graphs doesnt tell much about the quality of midbass, here I think its better to "read" the specs
It might be better to reach the 50hz due to lowish Fs, rather than rely on high Q values that might give floppy bass with lack of definition
Now we begin to look at very different drivers...what are your goal regarding SPL and just as important, what other drivers will be the playmates
You know, graphs doesnt tell much about the quality of midbass, here I think its better to "read" the specs
It might be better to reach the 50hz due to lowish Fs, rather than rely on high Q values that might give floppy bass with lack of definition
Now we begin to look at very different drivers...what are your goal regarding SPL and just as important, what other drivers will be the playmates
Well I can definately vouch for the Ushers (15HM) having very clean and natural output up to 700Hz easily. I have mine crossed over at 754Hz @ 48dB per octave. The Usher 15PA should be just about the same, except that it has a slightly higher Qts and Fs.
With the Usher's, a 200Hz HP xover point would be a walk in the park.
Also, remember that you said the 15PA was down -4dB @ 50Hz... That's NOT including room gain, which will most likely bring that up onto the +dB side of things. So just keep that in mind.
One more thing, at $109 each, they are the best bargain out there at the moment. In fact, I have one arriving tomorrow sometime for my center channel. If PE still has some by this time next week, I'm going to buy another one so I can have dual 15's in the center channel, perfectly matching my mains.
Actually, I just check and they are slap out of stock.
With the Usher's, a 200Hz HP xover point would be a walk in the park.
Also, remember that you said the 15PA was down -4dB @ 50Hz... That's NOT including room gain, which will most likely bring that up onto the +dB side of things. So just keep that in mind.
One more thing, at $109 each, they are the best bargain out there at the moment. In fact, I have one arriving tomorrow sometime for my center channel. If PE still has some by this time next week, I'm going to buy another one so I can have dual 15's in the center channel, perfectly matching my mains.
Actually, I just check and they are slap out of stock.
Thank everyone, definitly learned a lot from the posts!
I was thinking the same about the daytons, they might look good on graph but I really questioned the sound quality...
I'll restate what I'm looking for so we're all on the same page:
50hz-200hz ONLY in SEALED enclosure, able to play to 50hz without much drop in db. The whole system will be 85+ db hoping 90+. Each 15" will have its own 6 cu ft box (and I'm using 2 per side).
The other 4 way will be... (all sealed)
20-50hz Dayton RSS390HF-4 15" Reference HF Subwoofer 4 Ohm
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=295-468
200-1.2k Tad 1101H or 1102, I have both, but if I find JBL 2012 I'll go with that and save the TAD for smaller 2 way projects, overkill to use TAD for such small band.
1.2k-8k TAD 4002 with westlake audio's 2" horn
8k-20k JBL 2405 or 2407 (BMS 4540)
In case you haven't noticed, this is pretty much like the westlake's HR-1, with dual 15" subs as pedestals
Question also about my sub selection, anyone with experience wit the Dayton subs (sealed)? I don't think anyone will have problems with the top 3 ways... just kinda broke after buying all that so i'm skimping on the low end
Regards
I was thinking the same about the daytons, they might look good on graph but I really questioned the sound quality...
I'll restate what I'm looking for so we're all on the same page:
50hz-200hz ONLY in SEALED enclosure, able to play to 50hz without much drop in db. The whole system will be 85+ db hoping 90+. Each 15" will have its own 6 cu ft box (and I'm using 2 per side).
The other 4 way will be... (all sealed)
20-50hz Dayton RSS390HF-4 15" Reference HF Subwoofer 4 Ohm
http://www.partsexpress.com/pe/showdetl.cfm?&Partnumber=295-468
200-1.2k Tad 1101H or 1102, I have both, but if I find JBL 2012 I'll go with that and save the TAD for smaller 2 way projects, overkill to use TAD for such small band.
1.2k-8k TAD 4002 with westlake audio's 2" horn
8k-20k JBL 2405 or 2407 (BMS 4540)
In case you haven't noticed, this is pretty much like the westlake's HR-1, with dual 15" subs as pedestals
Question also about my sub selection, anyone with experience wit the Dayton subs (sealed)? I don't think anyone will have problems with the top 3 ways... just kinda broke after buying all that so i'm skimping on the low end
Regards
BHTX- this is for personal listening pleasure, I don't like the wild phase shifts I get with vented systems, that's why i want all sealed. This will be 5 way digitally crossed penta amp system. My father and I have had a lot of experience with vented systems (commercial products) and we're wondering if a DIY all sealed system would be better.
Systems we've had:
jbl olmpus
watt puppy 6
atc 70 (active 3 way)
altec a5
altec a6
tannoy westminster
tannoy big red monitor
westlake bbsm10 with SWP
mcintosh (dont know model, before i was born)
So you can see that we've had some sorta big systems, but all within 3 way (except westlake bb10 w/sub) and rely on vented bottom end (or passive radiators). We're hoping to achieve the cleanest smoothest sound from 20-20k by DIYing our own system.
We're currently using BMS 4592nd for high and mid, altec a6's dual 15" (vented) and celestion subs with digital crossover and digital eq. What we're using is pretty much the system we want to build except some minor adjustments. For example, seal the 15" woofers for better integration with sub, and add a nice 10" for the human voice range. I said 200hz to 1.2 but depending on the driver,100hz crossover point is what I really want. After that, DIY a nice big box with veneer and I think we're set
Comments and suggestions welcome, it's our first DIY project!
Regards
Systems we've had:
jbl olmpus
watt puppy 6
atc 70 (active 3 way)
altec a5
altec a6
tannoy westminster
tannoy big red monitor
westlake bbsm10 with SWP
mcintosh (dont know model, before i was born)
So you can see that we've had some sorta big systems, but all within 3 way (except westlake bb10 w/sub) and rely on vented bottom end (or passive radiators). We're hoping to achieve the cleanest smoothest sound from 20-20k by DIYing our own system.
We're currently using BMS 4592nd for high and mid, altec a6's dual 15" (vented) and celestion subs with digital crossover and digital eq. What we're using is pretty much the system we want to build except some minor adjustments. For example, seal the 15" woofers for better integration with sub, and add a nice 10" for the human voice range. I said 200hz to 1.2 but depending on the driver,100hz crossover point is what I really want. After that, DIY a nice big box with veneer and I think we're set
Comments and suggestions welcome, it's our first DIY project!
Regards
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