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Old 13th January 2008, 10:54 PM   #1
daniels is offline daniels  Denmark
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Default Best midrange driver, 4-way?

I have been building loudspeakers for quite some time now (fifteen years!?) and has usually been crippled by limitations of the listeners HiFi cave.
But now I have been given some loose boundaries and I want to build a construction I have been working on for some years now.

I have measurement tools to do all common measurements and T/S parameters of drivers.

My loudspeaker constructions have so far been built on some very good experience with the following drivers:

High range:
1 x Scan-Speak R2904-700000, 1” Dome. (approx. 7kHz-x, 6db/octave).

Upper mid-range:
1 x Accuton C2 44/8, 2” ceramic driver. (approx. 1,5KHz-7KHz, 12dB/octave).

Lower mid-range:
? (approx. 100Hz-1,5KHz, 12dB/octave).

Bas:
Scan-Speak 1 x 26W8861T00 (approx. x-100Hz, 12-24dB/octave).
or
Peerless XXLS (830847) (approx. x-100Hz, 12-24dB/octave).

The working frequencies are only guidelines so far but I would like to find a pretty broadband middle range driver. From the above you can see it is a four-way loudspeaker I am aiming for.
Each of the drivers has some qualities I really like. I am not entirely set on the Scan-Speak 26W8861T00 yet (in closed enclosure). If I go for it I will probably use two on each side. But two 12” Peerless XXLS (830847) in each side is scheduled for testing as a possible replacement (closed enclosure).

I already have acquired the drivers listed above but I am having problems deciding on what to use as lower mid-range… SOMEONE HELP!

I have these drivers lying around and just waiting to be tested:
Audio Technology 6”
Audio Technology 8”
Scan-Speak 18W8531G00

But I am not sure if one of these drivers can do the proper job or I have to go for a different driver. Off course it would be nice to be able to use one of the drivers I already have in possession, but if there is some driver out there that does a better job then perhaps that’s the way I should go (?)

So after all this chit chat it all comes down to;

Which lower midrange (high-end!) driver can YOU recommend?

And for the bas; Scan-Speak 26W8861T00 or Peerless XXLS (830847) bas driver?
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Old 14th January 2008, 10:18 PM   #2
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Quote:
Which lower midrange (high-end!) driver can YOU recommend?
http://www.clofis.nl/nl/thiel/C173N-T6-96.pdf
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Old 14th January 2008, 10:30 PM   #3
daniels is offline daniels  Denmark
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Nice!

Looks really nice.

But is it not so new that no one has made some practical experience with this driver?

Not everything new is good
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Old 14th January 2008, 10:59 PM   #4
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Quote:
But is it not so new that no one has made some practical experience with this driver?
not with this one but with these ones (opinions from two friends of mine using these drivers):
http://www.clofis.nl/nl/thiel/C90-T6.pdf
http://www.clofis.nl/nl/thiel/C220-NT6.pdf
Both are the best you can hope from accuton technology in there intended application. C2/173NT6 has same motor configuration and allows a very good application in the 100-1500hz IMHO. I'm going to use the C2/220NT6 as bass/lower mid driver to complete my sub woofer speaker. If you are hoping for best accuracy/high neutrality, have no fear about this C2/173NT6.
Quote:
Not everything new is good
on the market since about one year and...not everything old is good
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Old 14th January 2008, 11:16 PM   #5
daniels is offline daniels  Denmark
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I must say I have had very good experience with Accuton drivers.
I still consider the C2 44/8 driver on of the best drivers within its frequency range.

I just thought it was new since I have not seen it before.
I usually visit this site: http://www.thiel-partner.de/e/data/p...c_drivers.html
And they do not mention it.

It does look nice. Hope it sounds nice too. Well it propably do, if it is anything like the other Accuton drivers

So far it is competing with Audio Technology Flexunits (6" and 8"), Scan-Speak 18W8530G00 and Seas W22 series.
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Old 15th January 2008, 01:15 AM   #6
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Yes, the official accuton web site is no more updated since a long time; I asked their team a few weeks ago: "we have presently other priorities", haha.
I still consider the accuton membranes having something to their own which make their sound very uncoloured, ones calling it "cold, clinical, or loss of musicality". To my mind it's simply the most accurate acoustical translation from the electrical signal if correctly filtered. Astonishingly and obviously, classical measurements don't show any particularity...
IMHO, AT and SS ranges, even if very well designed and build cannot fully compete, particullary vs this neodymium underhung accuton range of drivers. But it's also and mostly a matter of taste and filtering these AT and SS certainly is simplier, also allowing to use lower order passive filters which can be attractive.
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Old 15th January 2008, 10:30 AM   #7
daniels is offline daniels  Denmark
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Nice to hear they are so busy making the best drivers possible that they do not have time to present new drivers to the public...

Accuton is also the most correct drivers in my opinion.

When referred to as musicality or warmth often means coloration and harmonic distortion - which should not be build into loudspeakers in my opinion.

You can always add some musicality with a tube amp or even just a tube buffer.

I have actually heard a very nice setup with and without a tube buffer and with great succes. It sounded really great.

But for the loudspeakers my main priority is to make them so what goes in comes out. No coloration here.
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Old 15th January 2008, 02:09 PM   #8
tf1216 is offline tf1216  United States
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You will get mixed opinions about Accutons, Revelators, Excels, and C-Quenze drivers when asking which drivers are better. It really comes down to one's taste and how they heard the different drivers implemented in my opinion.

My favorite driver to date is the C-Quenze driver which I have in a 2-way with the Scan-Speak 6600 tweeter. For your case, I would not suggest an AudioTechnology driver. I would think it would be a good idea to use an Accuton for the lower-midrange to mate with the Accuton playing the upper-midrange. Using a paper driver for the bass section could work though. It's a matter of taste and proper implementation.
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