First pair of DIY speakers

[drproton]

hello everyone,

I guess the subject is a lie. I've built DIY speakers before, but not since I was 16. I'm looking for a pair of speakers to use with my computer and or as surround speakers. I've spent a few hours reading through the forum, here is what I have come up with:

I would much rather use a "canned" design. I don't have time to (re-)learn all the engineering involved in proper speaker design. I'm actually an electrical engineer and I once knew a fair bit about speaker design. However, my goal is to spend some time and save some money to get a good set of speakers, not spend a lot of time tinkering to get my own design right.

I would like to spend somewhere around $300 on a pair of speakers (cabs excluded). I was definitely thinking of a bookshelf design, preferably something a little smaller (<15" tall). This is not set in stone, sound quality is still the higher priority. A basic two-way or MTM design is what I had in mind. If I go to the higher side of my price range, something biampable would be good. I suppose in the worst case I just use my own speaker terminals and spilt up the crossovers.

In the future I may want to expand this system. Something that matches well with a center channel and/or sub kit would be preferred. They should also work well with my main speakers, B&W DM602s (1st gen). If the kit sounds better, then the 602s get hooked to the computer. I would also entertain the idea of building the sub at the same time if it made the sound really come together for the kit I choose.

I listen to all kinds of music from jazz/big band/swing to classical to obscure punk rock and heavy metal. However, I only listen to the former critically and at what I'd consider "medium" volume. I can still hear the phone ring over the music.

I will be building the cabinets. One tool I have at my disposal is a CNC router. I can draw the panels in autocad and in a matter of minutes have dimensionally perfect parts. I will have to buy a couple more tools to do the assembly. I done a lot of woodworking / machining / model building. The only part of the cabinets I'm not skilled in is the finishing. I'll do some more research on this.

Some of the kits I am considering are;

Solen HI-VI melody research
Solen impression MKIII - at bit more than I'd like to spend
Solen premium
Solen vifi premium mini-monitor
any of the bookshelf madisound kits in the 200-500 range
Northcreek echo
Northcreek okara II

All things being equal I would like to buy from a canadian supply, for less shipping cost/hassle.

I'd like to hear and recommendations/reviews on kits in this price range, and not unnecessarily just the ones listed above. I did come across some other sites that sold kits, but I can't seem to find them right now. Another other comments would be appreciated. Sorry for the rant, and thanks for your help.

[Jay_WJ]

I'd look at serious DIYer's designs rather than commercial vendor's kit products. In general, more careful attention is paid to details.

Take a look at:

www.zaphaudio.com

Also, consider any of my designs that may interest you.

[planet10]

If your consideration extends to a 1-way speaker, depending on your amplifier, the Fonken, mFonken, or the CSS FR125SR. Been a while since i've heard the 602s, but i did own DM302s and i like all of these better.

dave

[drproton]

I've been reading some of those DIY sites. The zaph audio one is especially great. It is quite impressive the level of thought that has been put into some of these designs. I've also come across some other interesting kits here:

http://www.occamaudio.com/shop.html

Anyone used these?

I had another thought about the biamping. maybe I could use two sets of dual binding posts. There could be a before XO and after XO connection. If using an active XO before the amps it might come in handy.

[planet10]

Originally posted by drproton
Anyone used these?

Not the kits, but those are CSS SDX7 & WR125ST drivers they are using... i am very familiar with those. I reckon the kits with the WRs is going to be better. The SDX7 is only recommended for use up to about 1 kHz (at least stock -- it does produce prodigous bass, they are in a number of woofers we are developing as helpers for the boxes i mentioned in my earlier post). Both od these drivers use XBL2 technology and are really very good (but can be made better).

The last time i visited Bob, we started out listening to a little MTM Bob had put together with the WR125ST & the AC 2si ribbon. These were biamped with a 2-way plate amp from Solen (or Bob). These were quite good. One of the purposes of my visit was to deliver to Bob one of the 1st set of EnABLed FR125SR. We popped those into a set of the 7 liter PE boxes (the less than stellar rectangles, not the nice new curved back ones). The room fell away and the MTMs were a distant memory. I've never seen Bob sit still for an hour and just listen to music

I have a set of the WR MTM drivers to treat up for Bob, to see how the MTM does with tweaked drivers... without it was flat & lifeless compared to the single FR125S. So if you go ahead with the MTM plan on tweaking them (all the info to diy tweak them is available)

At this point it is important to disclose that my company is the only source for pre-tweaked drivers (well not the SDX7 yet -- i'm still working on them) so one must factor in any potential bias i may have (it is interesting to note that after hearing the tweaked FR125SR, Al Wooley of RAW is having me do the ones for his kits)

If you plan on biamping te raw drivers can be had stock from Bob, or tweaked from me. Use the tweeter of your choice. If you want all the parts for passives from a single source by all means consider the Occams.

Note that in the deluxe kit they provide variovents for aperiodic loading... this is my prefered loading for this driver (ie aperiodic -- the variovents can be diyed a number of different ways -- these are essentially a chunk of fiberglass sandwiched between 2 pieces of gutter mesh.

For other designs for these drivers check out the Box Library at my commercial site (link below)

dave

[drproton]

Can you explain the EnABL thing to me? How much does it cost to get this done, assuming I don't do it myself.

Looking around some more the zaph audio SR71 kit seems popular. I am tempted to try one of these. It seems like a proven design and all the parts are available in kit form.

I should also point out that I also have a pair of DM302s. They sound pretty good for what they cost me, but are definitely a different class than the 602s. I would be kinda disappointed if my DIY speakers don't sound better than the 302s.

[MJL21193]

Originally posted by drproton

I'd like to hear and recommendations/reviews on kits in this price range, and not unnecessarily just the ones listed above. I did come across some other sites that sold kits, but I can't seem to find them right now. Another other comments would be appreciated. Sorry for the rant, and thanks for your help.

Hi,
This is not a kit, but a very nice speaker to build. Not complicated either.
It's a Seas coax driver that's $150.00 at Solen. Crossover as detailed by Tony is very simple to construct and not at all expensive. The box is also easy to build.
You can expect great performance from this one.

[SamL]

Another one that worth looking is GR-Research. Their kit are know to be very musical and he use quite a bit of series crossover.
http://www.gr-research.com/index.asp...TS&Category=11

Oh yes! There BESL. http://www.bamberglab.com/
He been in the industry for sometime and build a lot of MTM.

Have fun

[drproton]

I was aware of the baffle step compensation problem. If these speakers do outperform my 602s (they may very well do this) they go in the living room, where they can have a more appropriate placement. This is the location where I will be testing them. I will test them against the wall as well, if I hear any problem I will give Jay's XO a try.

The coaxial speaker also looks interesting. Madisound sells a kit using a similiar driver the T18RE/XFCTV2 (H1333). In the end the price is about the same.

I'll research the EnABL thing some more. I don't think the speaker I'm building will be using those drivers, so its not really an issue. I hate when my threads get hijacked and turned into a flame war. Lets stop before this happens.

[planet10]

Originally posted by drproton
I hate when my threads get hijacked and turned into a flame war. Lets stop before this happens.

I have split off the side discussion. Here are the links that got split off with the off-topic discussion

The side posts were slpit off to here:

EnABL side Thread

John's entire post is over there. I did take the unusual liberty of leaving a copy of the relevant part of the post here so that drproton would still have that info.

Originally posted by drproton
[B]Can you explain the EnABL thing to me?

EnABL Processes

http://www.pesupport.com/cgi-bin/config.pl?read=393330

dave