Manzanita Ultra
Thank you for your interest in the Ultra! I think you will really enjoy it!
The big issue for the baffle assembly is to make it as solid and rattle free as possible. This is essential! You can apply various damping materials to the rear, but for the most part, performance improvements, if any, usually don't justify the effort.
The large counter bore behind the Vifa really helps. Ideally, flush mounting on the front with the large counter bore on the rear yields excellent results. As mentioned in previous threads, some liked the benefits of adding a 6" diameter or so felt ring on the baffle face around the Vifa. I didn't find it made a lot of difference, but I am approaching 70, so the very high end is no longer available to me.
Other Baffle treatment(s) such as rounded baffle face edges can be done, but again, it's a diminishing returns kind of exercise. If you want to experiment, please do. A large card board mock up is great for this! For a bit of effort and little or no expense you can assess for yourself what modifications are worth the effort.
Hope this helps! Please let us know how your built works out. John
Thank you for your interest in the Ultra! I think you will really enjoy it!
The big issue for the baffle assembly is to make it as solid and rattle free as possible. This is essential! You can apply various damping materials to the rear, but for the most part, performance improvements, if any, usually don't justify the effort.
The large counter bore behind the Vifa really helps. Ideally, flush mounting on the front with the large counter bore on the rear yields excellent results. As mentioned in previous threads, some liked the benefits of adding a 6" diameter or so felt ring on the baffle face around the Vifa. I didn't find it made a lot of difference, but I am approaching 70, so the very high end is no longer available to me.
Other Baffle treatment(s) such as rounded baffle face edges can be done, but again, it's a diminishing returns kind of exercise. If you want to experiment, please do. A large card board mock up is great for this! For a bit of effort and little or no expense you can assess for yourself what modifications are worth the effort.
Hope this helps! Please let us know how your built works out. John
Driving the Ultra
Pano has a good handle on this.... I personally use either a EL-34 or KT-88 based ultra-linear push - pull tube amp with a SSRP front end design. At least 30 wrms per channel. Class "A" is even better.
The Ultra is a solid 8 ohm load with benign phase issues. One thing about this speaker is that it will tell you a lot about the amp you use with it. You can really hear differences between amplifiers and amplifier classes.
Pano has a good handle on this.... I personally use either a EL-34 or KT-88 based ultra-linear push - pull tube amp with a SSRP front end design. At least 30 wrms per channel. Class "A" is even better.
The Ultra is a solid 8 ohm load with benign phase issues. One thing about this speaker is that it will tell you a lot about the amp you use with it. You can really hear differences between amplifiers and amplifier classes.
Alternative Driver Source in the EU
Monacor is supplying a LOT of different drivers at good prices all over the EU - has anyone tested them???
Monacor is supplying a LOT of different drivers at good prices all over the EU - has anyone tested them???
https://www.monacor.dk/produkter/15-3/vnr/103320/
Impedance (Z) 8 Ω
Operating voltage -
Frequency range f3-4,000 Hz
Resonant frequency (fs) 25 Hz
Rec. crossov. frequ. (fmax.) (12 dB/oct.) -
Power rating 150 WRMS
Peak music power output 300 WMAX
Sensitivity 94 dB
Max. rated SPL -
Max. voltage -
Radiation angle, horizontal
Radiation angle, vertical
Suspension compl. (Cms) 0.26 mm/N
Moving mass (Mms) 73 g
Mech. Q factor (Qms) 3.03
Electr. Q factor (Qes) 0.99
Total Q factor (Qts) 0.75
Equivalent volume (Vas) 270 l
DC resistance (Re) 7.0 Ω
Force factor (BxL) 10.87 Tm
Voice coil induct. (Le) 0.8 mH
Voice coil diameter 50 mm
Voice coil former aluminium
Linear excursion (XMAX) ±3.5 mm
Eff. cone area (Sd) 825 cm2
Magnet weight 1.2 kg
Magnet diameter Ø 142 mm
Mounting cutout Ø 355 mm
Mounting depth 139 mm
Mounting hole diameter -
Hole spacing X-axis -
Hole spacing Y-axis -
Dimensions Ø 385 mm x 150 mm
Outside diameter Ø 385 mm
Width 385 mm
Height 385 mm
Depth 150 mm
Protective class
Admiss. ambient temp. 0-40 °C
Weight 3.9 kg
Sales unit 1
Type of speaker
Impedance (Z) 8 Ω
Operating voltage -
Frequency range f3-4,000 Hz
Resonant frequency (fs) 25 Hz
Rec. crossov. frequ. (fmax.) (12 dB/oct.) -
Power rating 150 WRMS
Peak music power output 300 WMAX
Sensitivity 94 dB
Max. rated SPL -
Max. voltage -
Radiation angle, horizontal
Radiation angle, vertical
Suspension compl. (Cms) 0.26 mm/N
Moving mass (Mms) 73 g
Mech. Q factor (Qms) 3.03
Electr. Q factor (Qes) 0.99
Total Q factor (Qts) 0.75
Equivalent volume (Vas) 270 l
DC resistance (Re) 7.0 Ω
Force factor (BxL) 10.87 Tm
Voice coil induct. (Le) 0.8 mH
Voice coil diameter 50 mm
Voice coil former aluminium
Linear excursion (XMAX) ±3.5 mm
Eff. cone area (Sd) 825 cm2
Magnet weight 1.2 kg
Magnet diameter Ø 142 mm
Mounting cutout Ø 355 mm
Mounting depth 139 mm
Mounting hole diameter -
Hole spacing X-axis -
Hole spacing Y-axis -
Dimensions Ø 385 mm x 150 mm
Outside diameter Ø 385 mm
Width 385 mm
Height 385 mm
Depth 150 mm
Protective class
Admiss. ambient temp. 0-40 °C
Weight 3.9 kg
Sales unit 1
Type of speaker
https://www.monacor.dk/produkter/3/vnr/104190/
TEKNISKE DATA:
Impedance (Z) 8 Ω
Operating voltage -
Frequency range f3-17,000 Hz
Resonant frequency (fs) 105 Hz
Rec. crossov. frequ. (fmax.) (12 dB/oct.) -
Power rating 20 WRMS
Peak music power output 50 WMAX
Sensitivity 87 dB/W/m
Max. rated SPL -
Max. voltage -
Radiation angle, horizontal
Radiation angle, vertical
Suspension compl. (Cms) 0.90 mm/N
Moving mass (Mms) 2.65 g
Mech. Q factor (Qms) 8.59
Electr. Q factor (Qes) 0.49
Total Q factor (Qts) 0.42
Equivalent volume (Vas) 1.3 l
DC resistance (Re) 5.7 Ω
Force factor (BxL) 4.48 Tm
Voice coil induct. (Le) 0.5 mH
Voice coil diameter 21 mm
Voice coil former Kapton
Linear excursion (XMAX) ±2 mm
Eff. cone area (Sd) 30 cm2
Magnet weight neodymium
Magnet diameter -
Mounting cutout -
Mounting depth -
Mounting hole diameter -
Hole spacing X-axis -
Hole spacing Y-axis -
Dimensions Ø 80.5 mm x 42 mm
Outside diameter -
Width -
Height -
Depth -
Protective class
Admiss. ambient temp. 0-40 °C
Weight 150 g
Sales unit 1
Type of speaker
TEKNISKE DATA:
Impedance (Z) 8 Ω
Operating voltage -
Frequency range f3-17,000 Hz
Resonant frequency (fs) 105 Hz
Rec. crossov. frequ. (fmax.) (12 dB/oct.) -
Power rating 20 WRMS
Peak music power output 50 WMAX
Sensitivity 87 dB/W/m
Max. rated SPL -
Max. voltage -
Radiation angle, horizontal
Radiation angle, vertical
Suspension compl. (Cms) 0.90 mm/N
Moving mass (Mms) 2.65 g
Mech. Q factor (Qms) 8.59
Electr. Q factor (Qes) 0.49
Total Q factor (Qts) 0.42
Equivalent volume (Vas) 1.3 l
DC resistance (Re) 5.7 Ω
Force factor (BxL) 4.48 Tm
Voice coil induct. (Le) 0.5 mH
Voice coil diameter 21 mm
Voice coil former Kapton
Linear excursion (XMAX) ±2 mm
Eff. cone area (Sd) 30 cm2
Magnet weight neodymium
Magnet diameter -
Mounting cutout -
Mounting depth -
Mounting hole diameter -
Hole spacing X-axis -
Hole spacing Y-axis -
Dimensions Ø 80.5 mm x 42 mm
Outside diameter -
Width -
Height -
Depth -
Protective class
Admiss. ambient temp. 0-40 °C
Weight 150 g
Sales unit 1
Type of speaker
Lack of high Qts seems to be the major problem if I did read this thread well enough. This is a long thread but not as long as the one Lynn Olson has going ;b
Just did a quick listen . Used the following drivers.
TC9FD-18-08
Eminence Alpha 3A-8
Eminence Alpha 4A-8
Eminence Alpha 6A
No crossovers used. Direct from a Behringer 500 power amp.
The Alpha 6 A is the most sensitive driver. Needs to be crossover over to a HF unit. As it is , it sounds a bit rough in the upper mid as there is a peak there.
The Tymphany TC9FD is noticeably less efficient than the Alpha 3A . It's surface area appears to be more and possibly can go a bit lower than the Alpha3A.The Alpha 3A appears to have more HF .....wonder if that is because it sounds louder than the TC9D! A direct ( same level signal ) side by side (A/B) comparison makes the TC9D sound dull compared to the Alpha 3A.
The Alpha 4A is significantly more efficient than the Alpha3A and has a very much larger surface area. More low end. Definitely needs support at the higher frequencies.....crossed over high.
I think the Alpha 4A with a 3/4 inch dome tweeter should sound very good. Don't really need a 1 inch dome unless there are other reasons ( like SQ ) to use that.
Will rig up one on an OB. I have a 1 inch neodymium dome . I don't have any 3/4 inch unit.
TC9FD-18-08
Eminence Alpha 3A-8
Eminence Alpha 4A-8
Eminence Alpha 6A
No crossovers used. Direct from a Behringer 500 power amp.
The Alpha 6 A is the most sensitive driver. Needs to be crossover over to a HF unit. As it is , it sounds a bit rough in the upper mid as there is a peak there.
The Tymphany TC9FD is noticeably less efficient than the Alpha 3A . It's surface area appears to be more and possibly can go a bit lower than the Alpha3A.The Alpha 3A appears to have more HF .....wonder if that is because it sounds louder than the TC9D! A direct ( same level signal ) side by side (A/B) comparison makes the TC9D sound dull compared to the Alpha 3A.
The Alpha 4A is significantly more efficient than the Alpha3A and has a very much larger surface area. More low end. Definitely needs support at the higher frequencies.....crossed over high.
I think the Alpha 4A with a 3/4 inch dome tweeter should sound very good. Don't really need a 1 inch dome unless there are other reasons ( like SQ ) to use that.
Will rig up one on an OB. I have a 1 inch neodymium dome . I don't have any 3/4 inch unit.
Thanks for the info on the Eminence drivers. It's good to look for other candidates for the fullrange tweeter. The TC9FD is a very good driver, but as you mention, not very efficient.
That lack of efficiency is just fine once you have tamed the tonal balance of the single OB woofer, it's not going to be very efficient on OB. But if you want to go to a double woofer build, the poor little TC9FD will run out of gas quickly - it just can't keep up.
That lack of efficiency is just fine once you have tamed the tonal balance of the single OB woofer, it's not going to be very efficient on OB. But if you want to go to a double woofer build, the poor little TC9FD will run out of gas quickly - it just can't keep up.
Maybe it might be an interesting experiment to try the Eminence Alpha3A against a 1 inch dome tweeter crossed over at say 3Khz . With an active crossover. Can it really compete ? The 3A cone looks really small compared to the TC9FD.
Just occurred to me that the 4A and 3A could work together with a crossover !
I need to measure their frequency response before doing any further tests. I'd probably do that on an open baffle. The 4A doesn't sound dull but certainly lacks 'air' ....sparkle!
Anyone tried the Dayton Audio ND20FB-4 tweeter ?
Just occurred to me that the 4A and 3A could work together with a crossover !
I need to measure their frequency response before doing any further tests. I'd probably do that on an open baffle. The 4A doesn't sound dull but certainly lacks 'air' ....sparkle!Anyone tried the Dayton Audio ND20FB-4 tweeter ?