Go Back   Home > Forums > >
Home Forums Rules Articles diyAudio Store Blogs Gallery Wiki Register Donations FAQ Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Closed End Transmission Line
Closed End Transmission Line
Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 18th November 2010, 06:49 PM   #31
Bill poster is offline Bill poster  Thailand
diyAudio Member
 
Bill poster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Bangkok/London
Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
The B&W would have been 4-way with or without the TL.

dave
True, the design wouldnt have looked right otherwise. I'm a bit gutted if I can't use a single closed TL between 175 hz - 20khz .. thought that was the answer to my prayers.
  Reply With Quote
Old 5th August 2017, 11:43 PM   #32
slmnklyc is offline slmnklyc  Turkey
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Turkey
Lightbulb Tapering shape and volume and lenght???

Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
1/2 wave is 1-way. And it changes if the line is tapered. This Natilus prototype can be shorter because of the taper.

Click the image to open in full size.

dave
Hi.
(1.25-2)Sd suggested beginning cross sectional area.
Length is 340/2f meters.
While tapering The tube, Is there any restrictions about VOLUME?
Supravox 165lb:
Sd:165cm2
Fs:64hz
Vas:42L.
When I calculated The straight closed end pipe Volume is about 46L.
It is some kind of infinite baffle.
340m/s is The speed of Sound.I think stuffing also affect this Value.
How do tapering effect The lenght?
Is there any equation to calculate The lenght when tapering being used?
(Lets say simple tapered shapes used to calculate easily).
Lets say we use use tapering wrt fibonacci serie.
??
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2017, 12:20 AM   #33
planet10 is offline planet10  Canada
frugal-phile(tm)
diyAudio Moderator
 
planet10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Victoria, BC, NA, Sol III
Closed End Transmission Line
Quote:
Originally Posted by slmnklyc View Post
While tapering The tube, Is there any restrictions about VOLUME?
You should try to preserve volume

Quote:
It is some kind of infinite baffle.
How do tapering effect The length?
If the line tapers towards a point, the line can be shorter. It is an attempt at an IB but smaller with the intent of the long, well-stuffed line to absorb the entire backwave.

Quote:
I think stuffing also affect this Value.
Does not significantly effect the speed of sound.

Quote:
Is there any equation to calculate The lenght when tapering being used?
There are simulators, they are usually used for ľ wave lines, donít know how they handle Ĺ wave lines.

dave
__________________
community sites t-linespeakers.org, frugal-horn.com, frugal-phile.com ........ commercial site planet10-HiFi
p10-hifi forum here at diyA
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2017, 12:40 AM   #34
slmnklyc is offline slmnklyc  Turkey
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Turkey
Quote:
Originally Posted by planet10 View Post
You should try to preserve volume



If the line tapers towards a point, the line can be shorter. It is an attempt at an IB but smaller with the intent of the long, well-stuffed line to absorb the entire backwave.



Does not significantly effect the speed of sound.



There are simulators, they are usually used for ľ wave lines, donít know how they handle Ĺ wave lines.

dave
Sorry But I couldn't understand.
If I should preserve Volume while tapering,I should start with bigger starting cross sectional area to obtain same Volume?
I started to think Volume(closed) is only related to ordinary closed box(air suspension or infinite).
And lenght should be FIX is 340/2f meter?
If use symetrical shape Volume, can I use The middle line For calculations?
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2017, 12:53 AM   #35
slmnklyc is offline slmnklyc  Turkey
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Turkey
Lets say we reduce The Volume to acoustic suspension volume and leght is The SAME.
Is it still possible to eliminate the ALL backwaves like the big Volume we started?
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2017, 12:54 AM   #36
phivates is offline phivates  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Willamette Valley
The thing is, a well damped 1/4 wave open TL actually works very well. The experts can advise on taper. If you like complexity, make a BLH.
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2017, 01:15 AM   #37
slmnklyc is offline slmnklyc  Turkey
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Turkey
Quote:
Originally Posted by phivates View Post
The thing is, a well damped 1/4 wave open TL actually works very well. The experts can advise on taper. If you like complexity, make a BLH.
I also like The Mr.Tetsuo Nagaoka 'Hasehiro back loaded horns' Design.
But I am still chasing my questions.My brain isn't there
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2017, 03:30 AM   #38
planet10 is offline planet10  Canada
frugal-phile(tm)
diyAudio Moderator
 
planet10's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Victoria, BC, NA, Sol III
Closed End Transmission Line
Quote:
Originally Posted by slmnklyc View Post
If I should preserve Volume while tapering,I should start with bigger starting cross sectional area to obtain same Volume?
Yes. The line can be shortened because th etaper bunches up the harmonics.

Quote:
I started to think Volume(closed) is only related to ordinary closed box(air suspension or infinite).
Bass response will be much the same as the driver in the available volume.

Quote:
And length should be FIXs 340/2f meter?
You can, but it really should shorten a bit from that. How much depends on the amount of taper.

dave
__________________
community sites t-linespeakers.org, frugal-horn.com, frugal-phile.com ........ commercial site planet10-HiFi
p10-hifi forum here at diyA
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2017, 04:16 AM   #39
slmnklyc is offline slmnklyc  Turkey
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Turkey
So can we assume Volume will be enough to break The air spring and The lenght will be 340/2f meter(tapering shorten this lenght).
It is pretty big enclosure For full range and woofer Drivers.
If I crossover The woofer at 200hz I can use full range Driver in The closed TL with managable size..
Can I ask a question out of this subject?
There are golden ratio enclosures in your site.
How do you classify them?(some kind of ported maybe?)
Thanks!!
  Reply With Quote
Old 6th August 2017, 04:25 AM   #40
GM is offline GM  United States
diyAudio Member
 
GM's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chamblee, Ga.
Net volume [Vb] determines how much output it will have and its length the tuning, so reduce Vb reduces available [mid] bass output and in general a TL's Vb needs to be anywhere from 4-10x Vas to get good bass output, so if you start at a closed point and need a 100" line, then the driver baffle area at the open end will be whatever is necessary to get the desired Vb.

IOW, if you make a TL's Vb = required for AS, then better overall to just make an AS box.

GM
__________________
Loud is Beautiful if it's Clean! As always though, the usual disclaimers apply to this post's contents.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Closed End Transmission LineHide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
how to combine Line array and transmission line together Jared Multi-Way 7 15th December 2012 02:20 PM
closed end high frequency transmission lines thadman Multi-Way 6 8th April 2009 02:59 AM
line array + transmission line ? zobsky Multi-Way 12 16th August 2006 05:18 PM
Transmission Line for or against? DJ Sense Full Range 5 10th June 2006 09:35 AM


New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 12:36 AM.


Search Engine Optimisation provided by DragonByte SEO (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Resources saved on this page: MySQL 15.79%
vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright ©1999-2017 diyAudio
Wiki