I am in the process of building a 3-way tower for my house. I am looking for suggestions on an 8 – 10 inch sub with good build quality, decent low end, and good sound in a bass reflex enclosure.
The setup will consist of a simple first order crossover using good parts. Low pass will be in the neighborhood of 200hz to 300hz
The tweeter is a Fountek NeoCD3.0MS
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=45_229_236&products_id=8191
The midrange is a Peerless 4. Not my first choice but I got them in a shipment that was wrong. After reviewing them I believe they will work well for me.
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1607
I have a budget of $300 give or take on the woofer or subwoofer
The setup will consist of a simple first order crossover using good parts. Low pass will be in the neighborhood of 200hz to 300hz
The tweeter is a Fountek NeoCD3.0MS
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?cPath=45_229_236&products_id=8191
The midrange is a Peerless 4. Not my first choice but I got them in a shipment that was wrong. After reviewing them I believe they will work well for me.
http://www.madisound.com/catalog/product_info.php?products_id=1607
I have a budget of $300 give or take on the woofer or subwoofer
I'm also interested in the L26 driver. Same situation; 3-way active loudspeaker. A local supplier suggest a 65l BR-cabinet giving a -3dB at 35Hz. Does this sound like a good choice, or would you consider a different size and tuning? I don't want the bass-section to act like a true subwoofer, but would like to get a good compromise between depht and "speed"/tightness with this driver.
Regards
Johan
Regards
Johan
I do not believe its good to mate a polycone mid with a metalcone woofer
And a ribbon mated with a polycone mid might not be very wise either, but might work though
With just 6db electrical you will get in trouble with any of those combinations
And a ribbon mated with a polycone mid might not be very wise either, but might work though
With just 6db electrical you will get in trouble with any of those combinations
Well, that was a bit grumpy
When you want 6db, you will have to select drivers very carefully ... and to me it is furthermore an indication that you dont know much about xo filter
I would take a different approach
Get a pair of those very nice 12" Fostex FW305, they are on sale now
Fore mids you could use the Fostex FF125K, cost very little
And the Fountec should be ok with this
Low xo point should be more like 500hz or more, and upper xo point well above 3khz, and you should be able to manage a "6db" filter
And think of the nice efficiency 😎
When you want 6db, you will have to select drivers very carefully ... and to me it is furthermore an indication that you dont know much about xo filter
I would take a different approach
Get a pair of those very nice 12" Fostex FW305, they are on sale now
Fore mids you could use the Fostex FF125K, cost very little
And the Fountec should be ok with this
Low xo point should be more like 500hz or more, and upper xo point well above 3khz, and you should be able to manage a "6db" filter
And think of the nice efficiency 😎
BTW... the Hivi RT2II "ribbon"(planar) looks very nice too ... neat and very smooth design ... I guess with very little diffraction
With a bit lower SPL it might be a better match ... less attenuation = smaller resistor = better sound
With a bit lower SPL it might be a better match ... less attenuation = smaller resistor = better sound
Well you are quick to bash a design and not give any reason what so ever on why you have come to your conclusion.
My slopes I have chosen are 500 and 5000. This may change once the design is built and tested. First order is very useable! I may not be a professional but I have been working with audio and designs for over ten years now. So I suppose that if you want to tell me that I don’t know what I am doing, fine. But if you want to push your opinion, then back it up with some information and facts.
Grumpy? No. Quick to push your opinion and not back up your opinion? Yes
This is why I hate dealing with forums because there is always a prick that knows everything, but never offers experience or dealings with the information they are trying to push.
If you have built a ribbon, poly, metal, and 6 db designs then explain your findings.
Where people fail to analyze speaker, designs is the fact that everything has to be based on what everyone else is doing. This in all aspects of audio is not true. The other aspect is that all people believe that it has to be 100% high fidelity.
I am going to continue with my design using my 1st order design. I will use my RTA and continue to test the design and work with the design. If it fails I will make changes. But I am smart enough not to rule something out before I try it.
My slopes I have chosen are 500 and 5000. This may change once the design is built and tested. First order is very useable! I may not be a professional but I have been working with audio and designs for over ten years now. So I suppose that if you want to tell me that I don’t know what I am doing, fine. But if you want to push your opinion, then back it up with some information and facts.
Grumpy? No. Quick to push your opinion and not back up your opinion? Yes
This is why I hate dealing with forums because there is always a prick that knows everything, but never offers experience or dealings with the information they are trying to push.
If you have built a ribbon, poly, metal, and 6 db designs then explain your findings.
Where people fail to analyze speaker, designs is the fact that everything has to be based on what everyone else is doing. This in all aspects of audio is not true. The other aspect is that all people believe that it has to be 100% high fidelity.
I am going to continue with my design using my 1st order design. I will use my RTA and continue to test the design and work with the design. If it fails I will make changes. But I am smart enough not to rule something out before I try it.
tinitus said:Well, that was a bit grumpy
When you want 6db, you will have to select drivers very carefully ... and to me it is furthermore an indication that you dont know much about xo filter
I would take a different approach
Get a pair of those very nice 12" Fostex FW305, they are on sale now
Fore mids you could use the Fostex FF125K, cost very little
And the Fountec should be ok with this
Low xo point should be more like 500hz or more, and upper xo point well above 3khz, and you should be able to manage a "6db" filter
And think of the nice efficiency 😎
My my, that was not well received 
Damn, and I felt so good about it ... I will not suggest anything then
Good luck with your project
🙂
Damn, and I felt so good about it ... I will not suggest anything then
Good luck with your project
🙂
What size room would you play the L26's in?
Be mindful the L26 only has an xmax of 7mm. I'm choosing it because I don't want deep bass and want to see what a stiff aluminium cone can do for bass compared impregnated paper etc....
I still plan to use my sub with the L26 for the bottom octave. I also reckon getting the L26 down to 40Hz shouldn't be a problem for moderate SPL without xmax issues.
Cheers,
David.
Inappropriate
I apologize as an American/human being to you tinitus. The previous statement to you was horrendous.
BC
tinitus said:My my, that was not well received
Damn, and I felt so good about it ... I will not suggest anything then
Good luck with your project
🙂
I apologize as an American/human being to you tinitus. The previous statement to you was horrendous.
BC
But Tinitus is right.
Mixing driver types at low order slopes can be very iffy !!
If using low order x-os you have to be very careful that the drivers will blend well, not only on paper, but also to the ear.
With metal bass and poly mid then back to a ribbon, I'm not sure that is going work all that well.
Also be aware that the Peerless 4" will not go all that low, so you really would want to steer clear of most Sub-woofer drivers, and use something more like a bass driver than a sub driver.
Maybe the L26 will be ok, but I suspect you will have problems getting the whole to sound like "one".
Mixing driver types at low order slopes can be very iffy !!
If using low order x-os you have to be very careful that the drivers will blend well, not only on paper, but also to the ear.
With metal bass and poly mid then back to a ribbon, I'm not sure that is going work all that well.
Also be aware that the Peerless 4" will not go all that low, so you really would want to steer clear of most Sub-woofer drivers, and use something more like a bass driver than a sub driver.
Maybe the L26 will be ok, but I suspect you will have problems getting the whole to sound like "one".
Andy Graddon said:
What's the reasoning for this? Wouldn't low order crossovers be the better solution and high order the poorer solution? Low order will "blend" the different sounds, where as higher order will give a harsh change in sound. No?
phreeky82 said:
Hi phreeky, good idea...
let's just give an example when that doesn't happen... difference of phase and cancellation. But you are right, that's why so many people like fullranges and coaxials for that matter.
Its not the order, its the metal bass then poly mid that worries me, they DO have different sonic characters, so they may not blend as well as you hope through the x-o region. That is my concern. !!
You can separate them if you use higher order x-os (that are generally required for metal driver speakers)
Paper to poly, poly to poly.. even softish carbon fibre to poly are all "doable" with low order, but the couple of speakers I have heard with such a difference of materials as you are suggesting just didn't work as far as I was concerned. Again, maybe just bad implementation !!
You may be clever or lucky, but if you are not sure , then I would lean to using a poly or paper bass unit.
ps: I nearly always use low order x-os with poly or paper cones.
You can separate them if you use higher order x-os (that are generally required for metal driver speakers)
Paper to poly, poly to poly.. even softish carbon fibre to poly are all "doable" with low order, but the couple of speakers I have heard with such a difference of materials as you are suggesting just didn't work as far as I was concerned. Again, maybe just bad implementation !!
You may be clever or lucky, but if you are not sure , then I would lean to using a poly or paper bass unit.
ps: I nearly always use low order x-os with poly or paper cones.
OOO, ouch !!!
I just looked at the L26 frequency graph.
The 4" Peerless will force the cross-over at around a minimum of 500Hz to keep it from over excursion if using low order, that means that, if you use low order on the L26, you will only be about 4 octaves down (24dB) when you hit that big break-up peak.
The L26 needs a way steeper slope and/or to be crossed in way lower, which the 4" isn't going to like at all !!!
Something like the Seas CA26RE4X wouldn't be such a problem.
I just looked at the L26 frequency graph.
The 4" Peerless will force the cross-over at around a minimum of 500Hz to keep it from over excursion if using low order, that means that, if you use low order on the L26, you will only be about 4 octaves down (24dB) when you hit that big break-up peak.
The L26 needs a way steeper slope and/or to be crossed in way lower, which the 4" isn't going to like at all !!!
Something like the Seas CA26RE4X wouldn't be such a problem.
ok, I'm no expert, BUT....
I was looking at this thread (from the initial login screen).
Why no an Eosone from ApexJr? (I am not affiliated in any way). Add one of their amps, defeat the crossover (or reconfigure it ) and under $300 for drivers and amplification and an active crossover (with mods needed)?
so the sub/bass driver would be crossed over at your chosen frequency ( if modding a stock crossover in the amp), at most likely a 3rd order.
Have it forward firing, then use whatever amp for your top end. The cone looks to be paper (see the rear view). go to a 6 1/2" Peerless, and then should be no probs with integrating the system. Build or buy a small plate amp, and have a completely active system.
Just a thought.
I was looking at this thread (from the initial login screen).
Why no an Eosone from ApexJr? (I am not affiliated in any way). Add one of their amps, defeat the crossover (or reconfigure it ) and under $300 for drivers and amplification and an active crossover (with mods needed)?
so the sub/bass driver would be crossed over at your chosen frequency ( if modding a stock crossover in the amp), at most likely a 3rd order.
Have it forward firing, then use whatever amp for your top end. The cone looks to be paper (see the rear view). go to a 6 1/2" Peerless, and then should be no probs with integrating the system. Build or buy a small plate amp, and have a completely active system.
Just a thought.
My room is roughly 20m2. I've just bought a DEQX PDC2,6P, and wanted to try an all-metal 3-way loudspeaker using the Seas L18 and the Seas Seas 27TBFCG alu-tweeter (the top section from Zaph's monitor with theese drivers). XO from 80-200Hz/probably 48dB/oct slope.Dave Bullet said:
Single midrange indicates that the L26 would be enough, and hopefully a good match. Guess I'll tune the L26 around 30Hz.
Regards
Johan
Thanks for the reply.. This is what I am looking for.. Not a well it wont work, end of stroy. Thansks for the replies... I am not disrespecting tinitus. I just want some info and not the well it prob want work because I dont think it will work.. I want input to help me get to a point where I can have a good sounding 3 way. Not a High F speaker that cost $2000
So if I can the poly 4 and put a metal 4 in place with a higher sens then I will make it?
So if I can the poly 4 and put a metal 4 in place with a higher sens then I will make it?
8675309 said:
Have a look at what Jack from NHT has to offer: http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/showthread.php?postid=1234996#post1234996
He's got some decent 8in and 10in drivers for very low prices!
8675309 said:
There's no need to insult anyone on here, especially when they take the time to post in your thread with the intent of helping you. If you don't like the suggestions that were posted ignore them. It would have been much more productive to ask tinitus why he made the suggestions he did or what experiences he has with similar designs.
8675309 said:
That's what everyone is trying to give you 😎
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