Visaton TI-100

chrismercurio · 16th July 2007, 05:40 PM

Zaph measured these and will be posting them on his site soon. I just wanted to share what he forwarded to me.

Thanks,

C

chrismercurio · 16th July 2007, 05:41 PM

HD

Jay_WJ · 16th July 2007, 08:51 PM

Impressive nonlinear distortion up to 1.5 kHz. But high 3rd order distortion in the upper midrange doesn't look so good. Considering price, I'd choose the TB W4-1337.

bigwill · 16th July 2007, 08:55 PM

I wonder how these would be as a fullranger with a shelf above 5Khz?

tktran303 · 17th July 2007, 09:35 AM

Quote:

... high 3rd order distortion in the upper midrange doesn't look so good.

Think of it as a feature, and why it can sound so "detailed", and had several rave reviews.

Crossed at 1Khz, there's probably nothing to write home about.

CeramicMan · 17th July 2007, 11:50 AM

Wait a minute... the distortion appears to stay well below 1% all the up to 5kHz, at which point the 2nd, 3rd and 4th harmonics represent 10kHz, 15kHz and 20kHz respectively.

It could sound great in the right system! I'm not sure about the huge magnet though. It seems a bit overkill.

tktran303 · 17th July 2007, 02:06 PM

Sorry, I must be having a bad day to be so grumpy.

First off, thank you Chris for sharing your personal results with us.

I would rate this driver above the TangBand W4 1337SA in the non-linear distortion department. This is probably the result of a better motor system.

On the other hand, what I was alluding to was that the cone's behaviour between 5-15Khz has prevented it from being a complete all rounder.

Compared to the HD below 1Khz, there is a slight jump up in distortion between 1-3Khz. This is probably related to the stiff cone break amplifying the HD components, and is not unlike some other metal cones like the SEAS Excel series. I have always suspected that drivers with this kind of harmonic distortion profile can sound "detailed", but sometimes "unforgiving"...

Now IIRC, Dennis Murphy said that this driver is great, but is a bit of a pain to work with. It's not god-sent midrange driver that many of us were hoping for. And from the FR measurements, I can see why- it would need a LOT of work to tame those double or triple peaks at 6-10Khz.

Once that's taken care of, I suspect it would make a great midrange driver.

Now if we could somehow mate the W4 1337SA's cone to the Ti100's motor...

chrismercurio · 17th July 2007, 03:08 PM

I have been very interested in this driver based on tests in German magazines and the fact that it is shielded. Zaph had the following to say about it and I tend to agree:

"Just got done testing the Ti-100's. Not too bad. Excellent midrange non-linear distortion performance, changing to average as frequency goes higher. Relatively sensitive also. The best use for these would probably with a large format tweeter crossed low, around 1600hz maybe. You could cross higher depending on how much that 3rd order HD bothers you."

I am thinking of using these with a BG Neo3PDR or the Visaton KE25SC. It would be cool to use the RAAL 140-15D but I have a new baby and spending 1k on a pair of tweeters is out of the question.

charliemouse · 26th July 2007, 03:56 PM

Bother. I've been waiting for Zaph's comments on these. I was really hoping this would sit between W22s and a scan-speak aluminium tweeter in a 'detailed' sounding system.

Anything metal compare favourably to the Ti100 or Tangband? The Tangband is going to be almost twice as expensive as in the US in europe, and only one supplier can get hold of it.

Anyone seen the TI100M? It is mentioned around the place, but not on Visaton's site, e.g. http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-1273-TI100M/Sound. It has a very strange ascending response curve :s

Jim Griffin · 26th July 2007, 06:59 PM

Charliemouse,

The Jordan JX92S likely would be superior to either the Visatron Ti100 or the TB W4-1337SA. The JX92S is a true full range driver with a 45 Hz resonance freq. and a 5 mm Xmax. It will go lower and higher than either the Visatron or TB drivers. Albeit at more cost though. In the UK you can likely get a resonable price for the JX92S.

Jim

17th July 2007, 11:50 AM	#6
CeramicMan diyAudio Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Brisbane, QLD	Wait a minute... the distortion appears to stay well below 1% all the up to 5kHz, at which point the 2nd, 3rd and 4th harmonics represent 10kHz, 15kHz and 20kHz respectively. It could sound great in the right system! I'm not sure about the huge magnet though. It seems a bit overkill. __________________ Lech

17th July 2007, 03:08 PM	#8
chrismercurio diyAudio Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Silicon Valley	Well, I have been very interested in this driver based on tests in German magazines and the fact that it is shielded. Zaph had the following to say about it and I tend to agree: "Just got done testing the Ti-100's. Not too bad. Excellent midrange non-linear distortion performance, changing to average as frequency goes higher. Relatively sensitive also. The best use for these would probably with a large format tweeter crossed low, around 1600hz maybe. You could cross higher depending on how much that 3rd order HD bothers you." I am thinking of using these with a BG Neo3PDR or the Visaton KE25SC. It would be cool to use the RAAL 140-15D but I have a new baby and spending 1k on a pair of tweeters is out of the question.

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16th July 2007, 08:51 PM	#3
Jay_WJ diyAudio Member Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Indiana	Impressive nonlinear distortion up to 1.5 kHz. But high 3rd order distortion in the upper midrange doesn't look so good. Considering price, I'd choose the TB W4-1337.

16th July 2007, 08:55 PM	#4
bigwill diyAudio Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: UK	I wonder how these would be as a fullranger with a shelf above 5Khz?

17th July 2007, 02:06 PM	#7
tktran303 diyAudio Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Perth, WA	Sorry, I must be having a bad day to be so grumpy. First off, thank you Chris for sharing your personal results with us. I would rate this driver above the TangBand W4 1337SA in the non-linear distortion department. This is probably the result of a better motor system. On the other hand, what I was alluding to was that the cone's behaviour between 5-15Khz has prevented it from being a complete all rounder. Compared to the HD below 1Khz, there is a slight jump up in distortion between 1-3Khz. This is probably related to the stiff cone break amplifying the HD components, and is not unlike some other metal cones like the SEAS Excel series. I have always suspected that drivers with this kind of harmonic distortion profile can sound "detailed", but sometimes "unforgiving"... Now IIRC, Dennis Murphy said that this driver is great, but is a bit of a pain to work with. It's not god-sent midrange driver that many of us were hoping for. And from the FR measurements, I can see why- it would need a LOT of work to tame those double or triple peaks at 6-10Khz. Once that's taken care of, I suspect it would make a great midrange driver. Now if we could somehow mate the W4 1337SA's cone to the Ti100's motor...

26th July 2007, 03:56 PM	#9
charliemouse diyAudio Member Join Date: May 2007	Bother. I've been waiting for Zaph's comments on these. I was really hoping this would sit between W22s and a scan-speak aluminium tweeter in a 'detailed' sounding system. Anything metal compare favourably to the Ti100 or Tangband? The Tangband is going to be almost twice as expensive as in the US in europe, and only one supplier can get hold of it. Anyone seen the TI100M? It is mentioned around the place, but not on Visaton's site, e.g. http://www.soundlabsgroup.com.au/p/V-1273-TI100M/Sound. It has a very strange ascending response curve :s

26th July 2007, 06:59 PM	#10
Jim Griffin diyAudio Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Tennessee	Charliemouse, The Jordan JX92S likely would be superior to either the Visatron Ti100 or the TB W4-1337SA. The JX92S is a true full range driver with a 45 Hz resonance freq. and a 5 mm Xmax. It will go lower and higher than either the Visatron or TB drivers. Albeit at more cost though. In the UK you can likely get a resonable price for the JX92S. Jim

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