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-   -   The strangest thing (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/multi-way/10376-strangest-thing.html)

Nielsio 27th January 2003 04:08 PM

The strangest thing
 
Well peoples, right now I'm listening to a very abnormal speaker system. Normally, I have an open-baffle speaker with a 12" Supravox and an 8" AER, XO at 300 hz. But I wanted to try something different. So I've put the entire speaker on a box, so that my 12"-ers are about 2 feet from the ground, and I've connected them full-range (AERs do nothing now).

The Supravoxes are pretty wide-band themselves (to ~7 khz), but with brute force equalization (Behringer Ultracurve) they now extend way up ~16/17/18 khz.

http://perso.wanadoo.fr/supravox/eng...285%20GMF.html

The results: I have to admit, this sounds pretty amazing. I have to get a better measurement, and fix some bumps, but the potential is so high! I hear more detail / differentiation of instruments etc than with my normal configuration.

With a top-end full-ranger you can't equalize that much LF, but with a low-end full-ranger, you can equalize a whole lot of extra HF, right?

tiroth 27th January 2003 04:17 PM

Not really, although there may be an issue of degree that works to your advantage. Probably the amount you can EQ top end ends up being limited by linear excursion, and the amount you can EQ bottom end is limited jointly by beaming and intermodulation distortion.

pinkmouse 28th January 2003 12:24 AM

Quote:

Probably the amount you can EQ top end ends up being limited by linear excursion, and the amount you can EQ bottom end is limited jointly by beaming and intermodulation distortion.
Surely you mean the other way round tiroth?

Nielsio

Sounds to me like you were having phase or crossover problems with running the two drivers together. Before you get carried away I would check your wiring and XO. You can quickly and crudely check this by using your Ultracurve to output low to one driver and hi to the other using extreme cut and boost of the faders for the different channels. This will also give you a rough idea of where the crossover point should be, so you can check that at the same time.

Nielsio 28th January 2003 01:15 AM

Quote:

Nielsio
Sounds to me like you were having phase or crossover problems with running the two drivers together. Before you get carried away I would check your wiring and XO.
I think you misunderstood me. It's probably on 'the AERs do nothing now'. I mean't to say that I haven't connected them in this configuration. So it's not a problem of some sort, but my intention.

So: the whole idea is to run one 12"-er fullrange, and equalize the top-end drop-off to around 16 to 20 khz.

So the main question is:
-Is this doable / will the 12" Supravox give out this amount of HF, or will it not be linear and cause some kind of distortion / and or intermodulation.

Niels.

pinkmouse 28th January 2003 08:23 PM

Ahh, got where you're coming from;)

IM distortion and cone breakup could be a real problem, read Kelticwizard's comments on this thread and it will give you an idea why.

You could try measuring this with a sine wave generator and an FFT program, this will give you an idea of how bad it might be.

slowmotion 28th January 2003 08:40 PM

Hi Nielsio

Have you considered running the 12" Supravox
up as far as it will go, without eq, and then adding a tweeter?
Small horn or maybe a ribbon ?

Nielsio 28th January 2003 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pinkmouse
Ahh, got where you're coming from;)

IM distortion and cone breakup could be a real problem, read Kelticwizard's comments on this thread and it will give you an idea why.

You could try measuring this with a sine wave generator and an FFT program, this will give you an idea of how bad it might be.

Thanks. I'll look in to it.

Nielsio 28th January 2003 10:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by slowmotion
Hi Nielsio

Have you considered running the 12" Supravox
up as far as it will go, without eq, and then adding a tweeter?
Small horn or maybe a ribbon ?

Yes, I have :-)

Fostex has a nice ~98 db tweeter. Supravox also. Ribbon, I'm not so sure (low efficiency).

PHY-HP and ESG3 (or how do you spell it) have very good ones, but are very expensive.

I think I'll have to do some experimenting with tweeter types, if I want to go for that. Also, if I do this, I think I'll go Bass-reflex (or closed) in stead of open baffle.

Niels.

BAM 29th January 2003 02:45 AM

I think one could get a nice warm tone from this, but I would suggest using it in a sealed box so that the cone does not try to go down too low. Of course, I'm not the expert on this, it's just my ideas.

felixx 9th April 2006 01:11 PM

Hi!
I have a same problem with 285.Maybe I think to add a tweeter is good but what do you think to add a very small one and put them (coaxical),by removing the dust cap and insert the tweeter on the same axe with magnet and gluing it.After that you could add dust cap over the tweeter.The crossover must be only a cap,maybe with a L-pad.
The tweeter must be very high spl. and also tiny.(1"tweeter-horn type).
I want to put them into MLTQWT or Voigt enclosure.
What do you think by that?


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