I am headed off to a little dorm room at the end of the summer, and there is no way my maggies are going to fit in there. I want to build a decent set of bookshelf speakers, for hopefully under $200.
I realize that most of what makes a speaker sound good is the crossover, and thats the part that scares me. DIY or kit, doesn't matter. What is out there? I'm rather intersted in planar tweeters and the Dayton RS series...
I realize that most of what makes a speaker sound good is the crossover, and thats the part that scares me. DIY or kit, doesn't matter. What is out there? I'm rather intersted in planar tweeters and the Dayton RS series...
how about $225 plus boxes?
Lou Corragio Cryolites
Beautiful TM large bookshelf
http://www.lonesaguaro.com/speakers/DaytonRS7/Cryolite.htm
Lou Corragio Cryolites
Beautiful TM large bookshelf
http://www.lonesaguaro.com/speakers/DaytonRS7/Cryolite.htm
Re: how about $225 plus boxes?
oh wow, how did I not find those before? The box is a little bigger than I was hoping for, but I think that might just be perfect. Anyways, if there are any more suggestions keep them coming. And the $200 is without cabinets, because I can make cabinets basically for free with stuff I've got laying around the house
rj45 said:
oh wow, how did I not find those before? The box is a little bigger than I was hoping for, but I think that might just be perfect. Anyways, if there are any more suggestions keep them coming. And the $200 is without cabinets, because I can make cabinets basically for free with stuff I've got laying around the house
1st off -- what kind of amp (because that makes a difference)
I could be considered biased (because i am), but for <$200 i don't think you will beat the musicality of a Fonken... (wants an amp with highish output impedance thou)
Stew might have a comment on those
BTW Stew, the end user who has the pair you trialled is stocked, here a snippet "These little Fonkens are some really exciting speakers, and there's not much stuff I hear that catches my ear. I don't know what the finished speakers and flat pak kits retail for, but I'd venture to say it's probably not $2500/pr? Nothing, I repeat NOTHING that small and inexpensive has any right to sound that good! ....
BTW, I think I've finally put my finger on exactly what it is I like about them so much. They don't sound ANYTHING like a box speaker whatsoever. All box speakers I've ever heard sound like box speakers, but these don't. I still haven't figured out exactly what it is they sound like, but whatever it is, it ain't a box speaker."[/i}
For systems that have amps in the other direction, the miniOnken with FR125S.
Both those might be pushing things size-wise by your earlier comment on the Dayton/Neo box, so then one can consider the aperiodically loaded FE125s which works really well or the (as yet untried) mFonken (designed to play in the same mind space os the Solo 103 but with a bit more oomph from the FE127)
dave
I could be considered biased (because i am
), but for <$200 i don't think you will beat the musicality of a Fonken... (wants an amp with highish output impedance thou)Stew might have a comment on those
BTW Stew, the end user who has the pair you trialled is stocked, here a snippet "These little Fonkens are some really exciting speakers, and there's not much stuff I hear that catches my ear. I don't know what the finished speakers and flat pak kits retail for, but I'd venture to say it's probably not $2500/pr? Nothing, I repeat NOTHING that small and inexpensive has any right to sound that good! ....
BTW, I think I've finally put my finger on exactly what it is I like about them so much. They don't sound ANYTHING like a box speaker whatsoever. All box speakers I've ever heard sound like box speakers, but these don't. I still haven't figured out exactly what it is they sound like, but whatever it is, it ain't a box speaker."[/i}
For systems that have amps in the other direction, the miniOnken with FR125S.
Both those might be pushing things size-wise by your earlier comment on the Dayton/Neo box, so then one can consider the aperiodically loaded FE125s which works really well or the (as yet untried) mFonken (designed to play in the same mind space os the Solo 103 but with a bit more oomph from the FE127)
dave
Your buget is tight but these two could be something to consider:
http://zaphaudio.com/audio-speaker19.html
http://zaphaudio.com/audio-speaker13.html
or if you want money left over for a sub, look at the next one. Someone assembled a HT system with 5 of these and he didn't bother with the filters... He couldn't beleive the relative quality for so little effort. Sorry I can't find his post.
http://zaphaudio.com/audio-speaker18.html
http://zaphaudio.com/audio-speaker19.html
http://zaphaudio.com/audio-speaker13.html
or if you want money left over for a sub, look at the next one. Someone assembled a HT system with 5 of these and he didn't bother with the filters... He couldn't beleive the relative quality for so little effort. Sorry I can't find his post.
http://zaphaudio.com/audio-speaker18.html
Fonkens and others....
well go here and read my review of the Fonkens in the June issue (you have to download it). I'm stew nelless
I am biased, because :
1) I was not expecting them to be so damn good!
2) if you can manage to build the box (just a little patience required, but no "expert" skills ) you will be rewarded completely out of scale to the effort and $$ required. OH, so not $8.88 USD ea, but at $130ish/pr for the modded Fostex drivers, they will outlast your need (unless big bass is needed) until you are well out of university/college/trade school.
3) read the article and the comments by Scott , re: using a resistor to reduce the dampening factor on amps that have a large one (most solid state types). Almost any amp can make music with these!
ok, now commenting on other suggestions:
Zaph Audio has been an incredible resource and an inspiration to all. I imagine any of his designs that fit your budget would be worth every penny you may spend on them. There are others out there to.
Troels Gravesen has a good site and projects (unsure if he has anything in your budget).
Zillaspeak is also a good resource, with good projects and information.
I still am "cheering" for the Fonkens though. For so little money , such a great value, and a longer term solution. If you don't blow the drivers, they'll last a long, long time..
Hey, another thought....Hemp Acoustics. Find or make some 20ish litre boxes and you'd get quite a bit of bass, and good sound as well. But double the price of the planet10 modded Fostex drivers.
Dave , very glad to hear that John(did I remember correctly?) is enjoying them. I know I did.
well go here and read my review of the Fonkens in the June issue (you have to download it). I'm stew nelless
I am biased, because :
1) I was not expecting them to be so damn good!
2) if you can manage to build the box (just a little patience required, but no "expert" skills ) you will be rewarded completely out of scale to the effort and $$ required. OH, so not $8.88 USD ea, but at $130ish/pr for the modded Fostex drivers, they will outlast your need (unless big bass is needed) until you are well out of university/college/trade school.
3) read the article and the comments by Scott , re: using a resistor to reduce the dampening factor on amps that have a large one (most solid state types). Almost any amp can make music with these!
ok, now commenting on other suggestions:
Zaph Audio has been an incredible resource and an inspiration to all. I imagine any of his designs that fit your budget would be worth every penny you may spend on them. There are others out there to.
Troels Gravesen has a good site and projects (unsure if he has anything in your budget).
Zillaspeak is also a good resource, with good projects and information.
I still am "cheering" for the Fonkens though. For so little money , such a great value, and a longer term solution. If you don't blow the drivers, they'll last a long, long time..
Hey, another thought....Hemp Acoustics. Find or make some 20ish litre boxes and you'd get quite a bit of bass, and good sound as well. But double the price of the planet10 modded Fostex drivers.
Dave , very glad to hear that John(did I remember correctly?) is enjoying them. I know I did.
I am going to be powering these speakers with a modified Sonic Impact.
That Fonken looks really cool. The size is about right, the price is good, the enclosure has a very unique design, however I'm a little worried about about the bass. It looks like it starts rolling off kind of hard under 60 hz. These will be playing without a sub, so I'm a little worried about that
That Fonken looks really cool. The size is about right, the price is good, the enclosure has a very unique design, however I'm a little worried about about the bass. It looks like it starts rolling off kind of hard under 60 hz. These will be playing without a sub, so I'm a little worried about that
BAss rolloff and the Fonkens...
I was powering the Fonkens with a 41Hz Amp6 Basic, which uses the same chip as the Sonic Impact..and enjoyed every minute with them, a perfect maych .
Please be less concerned about the bass. I know I was curious. Regardless, they will go pretty low considering the size of the driver. Placed near a room boundary (something that is most likely in a dorn room), the bass will get deeper. I tested the Fonkens well out into the room. I still enjoyed the speakers including the quality of bass.
I simply cannot express to you how good these speakers are inso few words words.
I was powering the Fonkens with a 41Hz Amp6 Basic, which uses the same chip as the Sonic Impact..and enjoyed every minute with them, a perfect maych .
Please be less concerned about the bass. I know I was curious. Regardless, they will go pretty low considering the size of the driver. Placed near a room boundary (something that is most likely in a dorn room), the bass will get deeper. I tested the Fonkens well out into the room. I still enjoyed the speakers including the quality of bass.
I simply cannot express to you how good these speakers are inso few words words.
spots25 said:
That is about right. But given you budget & size restraints there is nothing that will get you much lower, perhaps with more grunt, but not much lower (and to get lower you have to sacrifice elsewhere -- notably efficiency, with which your amplifier would be a significant compromise).
dave
I built a pair of Fonkens and really enjoy their sound. One note however, as stated on the Fonken page, they are best with vocals, jazz, folk, etc. They definitely start sounding strained with more complex music. If you like metal or other loud rock, I'd look at a more conventional 2-way.
pete
pete
widman said:
There is only so much a single 4" driver can do no matter how good it is. Actively relieving it on the bottom will allow it to play more/louder... althou just last week we throrouly enjoyed one of Ginger Baker's long drum solos on a pair of GR Fonkens with a (monsterous) 4 W Class A amp.
To get more bass, and the ability to play at higher levels means giving up something else. With the !5W from an SI to get bass & more level you need a bigger box (hoffman's iron law). To get more bass without an increase in size you will probably have to give up how loud you can play (limited by the amp). In any of these cases you will likely give up mids (due to an XO) or mids & tops (due to a larger FR). Or you can blow the budget.
That said, a simplier 15 liter bass reflex with an FE167 is a candidate. Doesn't go much lower, but is ~3 dB more efficient, with quite a bit more cone area. You do give up some mid & top finese. They are also pricier, but still probably within budget.
It all comes down to what priorities you have wrt a speaker -- even with an unlimited budget & room you have to make compromises.
dave
spots25 said:
At ~ 87 dB and with that complex XO, your SI is going to lay down & die (or at least sound like it)
Looking at the impedance curve, these don't go as low as the Fonkens. They may have more ultimate loudness capability in the bass, but with your amp you are never going to approach that.
The more idea we get of your needs & how you will use it, the more i think FE167e might be the best choice... at over 6 dB more eficiency that the Dayton it is like having more than 4 x as much power. Even stock it will clean the Dayton in the mids, only losing out on the top to the Neo. But at $65/driver you still have a budget for tweeters (doesn't take much to add some light to the top of a drooping FR -- the NEO3 doesn't have hi enuff efficiancy so that one wouldn't work), and it has the kind of impedance curve that the SI can live with.
The 15 litre box is about the same size as the Fonken, and it has similar extension in the bass. At 1 W it is producing more bass than the Dayton can generate with the SI pegged. And the same FE167 in a larger enclosure can go quite a bit lower,
dave
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