Celestion G 12-p80 **seventy Eighty**

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Electric Guitar loudspeaker

Hi pinky78,

The Celestion G12P-80 , "Seventy 80" is an Electric Guitar speaker, and is basically a cheaper version of their G12T-75, but that does not mean its no good - it will be OK.
Only slightly smaller magnet than than the G12T-75, but good efficiency at 98dB/watt/metre, and with 80 watts power handling it will work with an Electric Guitar tube amplifier of up to about 50 or 60 watts OK.

The "Vintage 30" is a specialist model for a specific type of sound - leave that one till you get going with amps and speakers for a while, and try one or two G12P-80s for now.

I see that model is available in both 8 ohm and 16 ohm Impedance versions, thus do check that the version you buy is the Impedance required to match the tube amp you want to use it with.
Most guitar amps are 8 ohm, though some are 4 ohm, and you would need to run two 8 ohm speakers in parallel for correct load for such amps.
Some tube amplifiers have switchable Impedance - on the back panel - and can be any two or all three of :- 4 ohm ; 8 ohm ; 16 ohm switched.

What did you specifically intend to do ?

regards,
 
First thanks :)

I want to do 2 speaker cabinet for 50W tube amp. I play mostly hardcore/grindcore and punk so I need more agresive sound, but also like good clean as well :)
I may get my hands on celestion g12m70. Are this better or not?
Which of this two you think will be better choice for me?
 
Celestion Electric Guitar Speakers

pinky,
which Celestion models have been available in Macadonia over the years ?

The original Celestion G12 electric guitar speakers were fairly low in Power rating.
After some years of development two models were introduced which became very popular, and from these most of Celestions' electric guitar speakers to date were developed:-

G12M - originally a 25 watt speaker, and currently re-issued as "G12M-Greenback" - Greenback refers to the colour of the plastic magnet cover.
M is the magnet size weight - 35 oz.

G12H - originally a 30 watt speaker, and is currently re-issued also.
H is the larger magnet size weight - 50 oz.

From the G12M the later models with the M size magnet are :-
G12-65 ; G12T-75 - both with the 1 3/4" diameter voice-coil.

Also with the M magnet were manufactured :-
G12-50 ; G12-70 - both with 1 1/2" diameter voice-coil,
and,
V12-80 ; G12T-100 ; Hot 100 -{a current cheaper priced version}-, all with 2" diameter voice coil.

The different voice-coil diameters create a different tone for each even when attached to the same type of cone.

With its 1 1/2" voice coil the G12M-70 -{you wrote you may be able to get}- you will get slightly more emphasized upper-mids and treble than with one of the 1 3/4" or 2" M type alternates.
This will probably suit the types of sounds you mentioned, BUT, part of those sounds depends on the type of Amplifier also.

G12M-70 was a more expensive speaker than "Seventy-80" -{relative to Inflation}, thus likely better made, thus IF the ones you are offered are in good working condition then buy those, but do try them to ensure they work if they are 2nd hand, and that you do like their tone.
Also their 35oz magnet will give a slightly tougher sound than the 30oz magnet of the Seventy-80, but still not too "controlled" such as happens with the H size 50oz magnet models.
Players who prefer the 50oz magnet models tend to like a tight bass sound and controlled mids, either for clean sounds, or for use when a lot of Effects' Pedals are used for various distortions and tone effects.
The M size magnet models give better sustain when simply driven hard by the amplifier than the H size, with-out added pedals, etc ...

The 50oz H magnet models are:-
G12-H ; Vintage 30 ; G12-80 -{now re-issued as "Classic Lead"} ; G12K-85 ; G12H-100.

There are several models with smaller magnet size and weight than the M and "Seventy-80", but I do not recommend those for the music types you listed because the small magnet speakers tend to get too soggy in their response when driven hard, and only 2 of those in a cabinet may be too low in volume level, regardless of how much you turn your amp up !

Thus, of the 3 models you mentioned, I recommend the G12-70, but what Impedance are they each ?
What Impedances can your amp be set to drive ? - look on the amp's back panel to see if an Impedance Selector switch.

If there are any good working condition 2nd hand speakers for sale of any of :- G12-65 ; G12T-75 ; V12-80 , I would recommend those also for your listed music types, as all these models sound good for Rock music styles, even with their each slightly different sounds.

Are you buying the 2x12 cabinet or making it yourself ?

Have you heard the differences in sound between Open back and Closed back cabinets with your preferred types of music ?

regards,
 
hey there

I finally have a cabinet!
:)
It's ok

I used 2 seventy 80 and they are great!
I made it from cheap board becouse i found some free :)

anyway, I think i should open it a little bit becouse I feel like the sound wants to come out :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))


Thank you all for the info


:)))))))))
 
I'm pleased you got a pair of Celestions, and have got some sound happening with your own cabinet !

pinky78 said:

I finally have a cabinet!

anyway, I think i should open it a little bit becouse I feel like the sound wants to come out :)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))



It seems you have made a closed back cabinet , yes ?

The sound will change in ways depending on by what amount you "open it" .
I suppose you intend to open the back of the cabinet -{not the front}- ?

All the dimensions of the cabinet affect the sound - especially the internal Height ; Width ; Depth , and then the size of the opening in the back -
-{don't open the front, unless it is a very large front cabinet in comparison with the area of the front occupied by the 2 speakers}-
- and where on the back panel you cut the opening.

If you like, post all 3 Internal dimensions here, and I'll suggest a size of opening and where on the back panel, for a start.
You can increase the size after you hear the effect of the first cut-out.

Do you want Louder ? , or only more Bass ? , or , to spread the sound around more ?
 
Hi Alan,
Am new to this forum so apologies if I'm jumping on the back of another query, but you seem to really know your stuff so was wondering if you can help. I've just bought a Celestion G12P-80 and want to use it as an extension speaker for a Peavey Classic 30 1x12" combo amp as i can't find the proper peavey extension cab anywhere. I've bought this speaker as it is 16ohm which I believe is correct and am planning to fit it into an old Marshall combo that I have (and just plug the hole where the amp was - do you foresee any problems in me doing this? Any help appreciated.
 
about the Peavey and Marshall ?

"substitute me for your Mum,
at least I'll get my washing done"

Hi Substitute,

'oi, wot is all this Peavey biznus ... where is your Hi-Watt ?
... well, if you are going to name yourself "Substitute" .. !
OK, at least you are considering using a Marshall extension cab, so all is not 'opeless 'ere ...

I have forgotten some details about Peavey's Classic 30, thus please Post here:

(1) - What is printed on the back of the amp section of the combo, or in the combo's User Manual, about Minimum Impedance load for total of all speakers connected ?
... or is there an Impedance Selection switch on the back of the amp section ?

(2) - What is printed on the back of the speaker that is in the Peavey combo ?
... both the name and number of the speaker, and its Impedance ?


I have a Peavey branded 12" speaker which is very like a Celestion,
and likely is made with all Celestion parts, but probably assembled for Peavey by Eminence in the USA.
I have forgotten its name and model number -{I will look later}- but I do remember that it is an 8 ohm speaker, thus why I ask what yours is ...
I have forgotten which Peavey amps this speaker was used with, but it may have been with yours, thus why I ask its name and number.


Yes, "plug the hole where the amp was" ... I have done this with a Fender combo's cabinet.
{well, Pete T. does use Fenders now}
I used 1/2" thick wood and completely filled the hole, and painted the front of the wood black.

What is the internal Width, Height, Depth of your Marshall cab ?
... and is it open or closed back ?

I ask the above so I get predict its likely bass and lower mids' performance with the Celestion.

I am presuming the Peavey cab is open backed ... yes or no ?

'oi, where are you, you have not included a Flag with your name !
 
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Hi Alan
You're right, I should be trashing a HiWatt, not using a Peavey, but got to look after my back mate!
First of all, thanks for the reply, hopefully this is the info you need:
There's no impedance switch, but the Peavey extension cab that goes with this amp (the one I can't find anywhere) is a Peavey 112e which is 16ohm.
Speaker in the combo is a Peavey Blue Marvel pro performance rated 16ohm
Number underneath is 70777144 (means nothing to me though!)
On the back of the amp case (near speaker ext socket) it says 30 watts 22vRMS 16 ohm minimum load.

The Marshall is open back but I intend to close it off as I've heard that would be better, but the peavey combo is open back.

Hope all this helps!
Thanks again
Duncan

www.substitute.org.uk
 
Closed back vs open back is usually a personal preference of the musician's.

I prefer open backed, as my previous experience with closed-back designs wasn't great (tried Marshalls, and my own design, with an Eminence speaker). The bass on both wasn't great, with the latter particularly displaying a very one-note midbass, around the 5th fret of the low E-string. The response fell off quickly below that.

I took the back off the cabinet, and found this bump in the response disappeared, but there was a slight lack of warmth. Turning the bass up to ~7/10 sorted this, leaving a fairly vintage tone. Smooth and warm, but adding distortion allows me to get a great sound, too. The rearward reflections made the sound more interesting, too.

Like I said, it's personal preference. Try it open and closed, see which you prefer.

Chris
 
i have just done something similar. I have a used Hartke 4x10" bass cab. ditched the speakers(read sold to a friend), and replaced them with 4 of G10M ~10" celestion 'greenbacks'. I must say that when they arrived, i was actually very impressed with the fabric dustcap and general quality of the drivers. (I got them at something like 35% discount in bargain corner of CPC btw).

I found something quite bizarre though. the bass is ridiculous. i could probably play a bass guitar through these things and get a good sound, albeit at 'non-concert' levels where im sure theyd run out of xmax. initial listening it was clear i had to block the 4" port up.......but closed box was much more 'flat', and rounded.

I found them incredibly warm, and smooth sounding. I had to back the bass control to about 9 o'clock, to get the 'crunchy' thrashy hardcore type sound the OP mentioned. The tone from these speakers on my DM120 watt valve head, is like cream. hit the +15dB button and crank the gain right up, and heavy is not nearly an appropriate enough word!
 
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Laney 4x12 Cab

Hi folks,
Just decided to register on this forum to make some questions about my gear. I have a Laney GS412IS cabinet loaded with 4 Celestion Seventy 80 (original), its main purpose is to use this as part of my equipment for the test of effects and mods I do in my studio. specifically with overdrives and distortions.
I have understood that Celestion Seventy 80 is an all purpose speaker, and though the sound is good, tend to emphasize the bass frequencies. Now, with the understanding that 4x12 cabs should be closed, I think the solution might be to buy 2 different speakers and combine these with the Seventy 80 to compensate and achieve a better balance.

What brand and model of speakers could achieve this, any help or suggestions?

PS: The total power of my cabinet is 320W and the impedance is 16 ohms, I understand that if you use lower wattage speakers total power is reduced, but this is not a problem because my tube amplifier is 50W.

Thank a lot, :)
Carlos.
 
cabinet size

Hi Alan
You're right, I should be trashing a HiWatt, not using a Peavey, but got to look after my back mate!
First of all, thanks for the reply, hopefully this is the info you need:
There's no impedance switch, but the Peavey extension cab that goes with this amp (the one I can't find anywhere) is a Peavey 112e which is 16ohm.
Speaker in the combo is a Peavey Blue Marvel pro performance rated 16ohm
Number underneath is 70777144 (means nothing to me though!)
On the back of the amp case (near speaker ext socket) it says 30 watts 22vRMS 16 ohm minimum load.

The Marshall is open back but I intend to close it off as I've heard that would be better, but the peavey combo is open back.

Hope all this helps!
Thanks again
Duncan

www.substitute.org.uk

Hi Duncan,

well, re-reading my earlier post to you I see I got 2 words wrong from the song, but hey you're still talking to me, and you're in a Mod band
... now surely you know those lyrics ... but wot's 2 words eh !

Now about this Peavey business and your back ... 'ave a look around and you will see that HIWATT now 'ave Combo amps !
... so you can flog that Peavey off to some Mark Knopfler type tosser and get the real thing, or at least get a VOX - those are liftable !!

'orright, I'll be serious now.
It seems that your Peavey is designed to accept a 16 ohm extension speaker, thus the G12P in 16 ohms will work.

About cabinets, open and closed back, my experience is similar to that posted by Chris661 {following your last post}.
For closed back the cabinet needs to be at least 40 litres internal volume to minimize that bass problem he described,
AND the ratio of internal Width : Height : Depth needs to be not a cube or 2 dimensions as harmonic multiples of the first,
thus what are the internal dimensions of the cabinet you are hoping to use ?

If significantly less than 40 litres {about 1.4 cubic feet} internal, then an open back can give a more even bass response,
though a bit less punch to the sound.
An open back cabinet should not be very deep {front to back} or the sound will get a bit honky around a small region of the lower midrange.
The front to back depth of most good sounding open backed combo amps is obviously close to the optimum.

My Peavey 12" is a "Sheffield 1230", which is apparently a 70 watt speaker.
It sounds a little bass-light in an open back cab. , but it has the characteristic sound of a 1.5" voice-coil speaker,
thus as the G12P has 1.75" voice-coil it should have a bit better bass oomph in the right open back cab. ,
but as it has a slightly smaller magnet than the classic M series Celestions it will not likely match them for bass oomph.

Peavey's Sheffield 1230 was made in the USA, but I think from Celestion parts, because it sounds very much like the Celestion G12M-70.
{G12M-70 was not a classic M series Celestion.
It was a more powerful upgrade of Celestion's G12-50 lower priced alternate to the then classic M model G12-65.}

I do not know if I've heard a Peavey Blue Marvel 12" live,
though various USA players have posted in Forums that they like them,
thus in combination with the G12P you may have an interesting sound !

Anyway, post the internal dimensions of the cab. you are considering, and I'll comment some more.
 
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try this model

I have understood that Celestion Seventy 80 is an all purpose speaker, and though the sound is good, tend to emphasize the bass frequencies. Now, with the understanding that 4x12 cabs should be closed, I think the solution might be to buy 2 different speakers and combine these with the Seventy 80 to compensate and achieve a better balance.

What brand and model of speakers could achieve this, any help or suggestions?

Thank a lot, :)
Carlos.

Hi Carlos,

the speaker I would listen to in combination with yours is Celestion's G12T-75,
because it is a bit brighter sounding in upper midrange and treble than seems to be the G12P.

Put two G12T-75 in 16 ohm versions in the upper positions in your quad box, and two G12P in the lower postions.
Connect the two Ts in electrical Series, and the two Ps in electrical Series, then connect the two Series pairs in electrical Parallel,
and you will have a total load of 16 ohms.

Connecting each of the same type together in Series causes the power to be better distributed to the drivers,
than when two of different types are in Series.
Different types usually work better when connected in Parallel,
but if you want to experiment and hear sound options yourself, then try other connections,
so long as your final connection is Series/Parallel so as to sum to 16 ohms.

G12T is a 75 watt speaker.
If it's price exceeds your budget, and you can't find good condition used samples, then try the G12M-70 that I described in the Post above,
because it is quite good in midrange and treble, and needs only a bit more bass, which your G12Ps will provide.
I do not know if it is still available new - you may have to look for good condition used samples.

Another good Celestion model which you might find used samples of in good condition is the G12-65, a 65 watt speaker.
It was the power uprated version of the original 25 watt version of G12M years ago.
I have some G12Ms with the 65 cones and voice-coils fitted. The sound is good through all of bass, midrange, and treble.
 
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Hi Duncan,

.......

About cabinets, open and closed back, my experience is similar to that posted by Chris661 {following your last post}.
For closed back the cabinet needs to be at least 40 litres internal volume to minimize that bass problem he described,
AND the ratio of internal Width : Height : Depth needs to be not a cube or 2 dimensions as harmonic multiples of the first,
thus what are the internal dimensions of the cabinet you are hoping to use ?
......

I'm glad it's not just me.

I didn't consider cabinet volume when making my extension speaker (figured there'd be little need, for guitar use. I just made it to be the same front area as my combo amp, but about twice as deep.

Something I'd recommend when using a solid state amplifier:
add an output transformer. 1:1 ratio. A transformer with a centre-tapped secondary will do (I used a 12-0-12 torodial).
Anyway, it sounds really amazing. Most of us have such transformers lying around. I tried 3, each with their own sound, before picking the 12-0-12. Another had better sound, but it was over double the weight. Not good for teenager drag-it-anywhere use.

Anyway...
 
internal dimensions ?

Hi Chris,

what are the internal dimensions of your open backed cabinet ?

If I've understood your earlier post correctly you have a single speaker in the cabinet..?

I have heard part of that transformer idea before, but never tried it because my guitar amps are valve,
however I will mention the idea to anyone with a solid state amp who wants a change but cannot afford a valve amp.

Where did you connect the centre-tap to ?
 
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Hi,

I have two parts to my rig... A 1x10" combo amp, and a 1x12" extension cab
The extension speaker is 14"x15"x8 1/2" hwd. The combo amplifier is around 5" deep. Anyway, there's details over in the last post on my blog if you'd like to know more. Here..

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/blogs/chris661/477-guitar-amps.html

I know the first one is a bit dark, but here's a couple of snaps.

An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.


An externally hosted image should be here but it was not working when we last tested it.


... and the second one's blury.

Here's a wiring diagram on how to connect up the output transformer (see attached).

Chris

PS - I'll try to get some sound clips out there at some point.

Edit - on the diagram below,
the negative is the centre tap of the transformer. The amplifier is connected to one end, the speaker connected to the other.
 

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Hi Carlos,

the speaker I would listen to in combination with yours is Celestion's G12T-75,
because it is a bit brighter sounding in upper midrange and treble than seems to be the G12P.

Put two G12T-75 in 16 ohm versions in the upper positions in your quad box, and two G12P in the lower postions.
Connect the two Ts in electrical Series, and the two Ps in electrical Series, then connect the two Series pairs in electrical Parallel,
and you will have a total load of 16 ohms.
.

Hi Alan,

Let me first thank you for your pots, you seem to be a connoisseur of Celestion speaker .. Your idea is good..!!

I have only one doubt about this, as I said earlier, I use my cabinet along with several amps (Fender, Marshall, Peavey and Krank) for testing purposes (I built and / or modify effects), the idea of the Celestion Seventy 80 is that they serve well for many purposes. Are G12Ts the same?, I know that these are well recognized for Marshall´s, but what about Metal?

In any case, what do you think of the Celestion Vintage 30 ?

Thanks,
Carlos.
 
From working in a guitar shop for the last ten years, my opinions are thus:

Neither the G12T-75 and Vintage 30 are neutral. The 75 is mid-scooped, and the 30 has an upper-mid hump. Their character will work well with each of your amps except the Fender, which won't sound so much like a Fender anymore, and that's why you have it, right?

The G12T-75 has a bad rep among tweakers, simply because it's so common. But that's the very reason you should have one in your stable for testing purposes. Most players don't trade out the speakers in their Marshalls.

The Vintage 30 is the darling of the metal crowd, and again, if you're making a "Metal Madness" pedal, it needs to be tested with a V-30 as that's most likely what your target audience will be using.


HTH,
Keri
 
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