Beginning my first project
I have decided to start making some speakers for myself. These will be the first ones that I'm not going by a plan for. I've built countless subwoofer boxes for cars, and as far as home speakers go I've only built an Eton 8.1 Kit from madisound for a friend.
Right now I have little bose Interlude 2000 series bookshelfs that annoy me to no end. They have a 6.5" Driver and I've heard more bass response from a 4".
What I've been looking at is the Peerless 811815 Tweeter, and the Peerless 850122 Woofer. It will be a 2 way set up and I'd like to make floorstanders out of them. I do have very nice speaker stands I made myself, however, and if the woofer works better in a bookshelf design, I can use the stands.
Several Concerns I have:
The driver cost of around $115 is where I'd like to stay if anyone has any other driver suggestions.
Winisd is showing me a 1.2 cube box tuned to 35 Hz. Is this a good size or should I play around with it more?
Will the drivers work together well? Where should I start with a cross over design?
I dont have any speaker anaylsis software, so I have to do everything by ear, which will be referenced to the previously mentioned Etons.
What brand caps, inductors, and resistors would suit these drivers potential well?
Is there a proven design that others have built with these drivers? I've seen the woofer implemented before, but with a different tweeter.
Thank you for all help!
Hello PEERLESS lovers!
:cool: Peerless! :cool:
Is it something in the Air, or what. :)
Suddenly people discover that they will build Peerless LSP. :)
SkinnyBoy: My Speakers!!! I Have Decided!!! Peerless All The Way!!!
And here is the answer to him, from kelticwizard:
Can't go wrong with Peerless. Personally, I prefer the 10" in the CSX line, because it has a large excursion-9 mm-plus it goes all the way to 2,000 Hz. It is an improved version of the CCC 10" subwoofer which at one time was one of the best subs you could buy. But the 8" is also good.
I can add to this:
Peerless makes drivers, with VERY good Value for money.
Especially good for Vented boxes. ;)
You could join SkinnyBoy thread or he can join yours.
Or you can try keep BOTH threads alive .....
I, halojoy, wish you the best of luck with your first serious
:angel: I will help with what little I know.
Good Luck, ;) onebadziggy ;)
/halo - helps to place one bad ziggy on the top of the agenda
Wait man, this is not finished. This afternoon I am veneering my Totem Arro Clone. All Peerless drivers. I should be able to post something in a few days.
Peerless is attacking from all sides ....
/halo - takes cover :eek: :eek:
Heh, I'd make a all peerless design too... If i had the money... (bah...)
well halo, I do believe its in the air, as I was going to go for Vifas, but then decided that peerless looked really good too.
I think I will commence the ordering of the drivers on madisound's next buisness day.
But one question- how would a two way be with the tweeter I picked and the 10" CSX as opposed to the 7"? Would I have a sonic gap? I ask this becasue I will most likely not be implementing a subwoofer into the system, at least for a long while.
I'm sooo excited!:D :D
*running around singing* gonna get better than my boses for less! *running around singing*
Woofer+Tweeter - Sizes
There might not be a gap in freq-curve. Not on axis.
But a big Woofer can not spread the sound.
It is against physical laws.
You can not have 10 inch and baffle small in width either.
250 mm is not a narrow baffle.
And the distance center-center dome-woofer
will be long, say 180mm (250/2 + 110/2) which is big compared
to crossover wavelenght.
All this will limit the spread of soundwaves at upper mid.
And the upper mid, say 1000Hz - is not what a 10" do best.
For my own two-way, I do not like to go for bigger woofer than
5 1/4" = 135mm
I just bought Audax HM130Z0 - as base for 2-way system.
It is 130mm.
And then you should know that I search for tweters that
go low. FS< 750 Hz and crossover preferable not above 2000-2500Hz.
Scanspeak have tweeters with fs=500-600
Vifa D27 has something like 650-750Hz.
A good thumb rule, when using 12dB filter
is to select crossover at least 2 octaves above Fs.
That is Cossover Freq >= 4 x Fs
So if you want good directional info from that area
(upper mid)and in the crossover region,
you should not use too large woofer
and not select crossover frequency too high.
And, it could be as you say "a gap".
Now many commercial speakers are having just that:
a lot of bass and good high frequency
and a gap in middle.
This is because the sellers have discover that such sound sells!
The customers like it. (They make such tests on gruops of people).
But it is not accurate reproduction of music/sound.
And can not be called HIFI.
In the end it comes downto what your goal is.
for disco your solution is perfect.
for natural music that sounds "as it is intended to"
it is not the optimal way.
This was a long answer
This site contains a project that uses the Peerless drivers that you mentioned. Check out the Peerless Pipes. I'm thinking about building a set myself.
Some comments on halo's comments
halo has done his homework
on the "modern 2-way"
what he says is fairly standard thinking
but there are other sets of compromises
that work well too...
more than one way to skin a cat
So here to widen the possibilities...
an early 60s vintage Foster (parent of Fostex)... to quote hurdygurdyman
(in the above case)
by executing a dustcapectomy,
adding a phase plug
and adding a small T
to the end of the phase plug
But this strays far from the convential
it be more like a Frugal-phile[tm] tannoy
You give up bass for better mids
a higher XO to the T
(and a sub is always a good idea*)
* most may think a sub
It does, but
the most imporatnt thing it does
is make the mids better
in my personal experience set
but reports are that it is fine
One i have known
that is VERY good
the VIFA P13
and François will soon
report on his little Peerless
NO XO from 250 to 4K
(even lower & higher is better)
the XO is always a weak link
best it not be somewhere
where the most critical stuff lives
is sound intellectually
but puts a mucky XO
right where it shouldn't
and a higher XO can often be
of a simpler kind -- less muck
ie the VIFA P13 can XO to a suitable T
with a single cap,
and sounds best (IMHO)
when used so
My less conventional set
has a single cap
to bring the T in at 10k
from a wise man
thanks planet10 for your comments
I have noticed your comments with real thoughts
I know you have very more real world practical experience
than I have
Especially that about not putting the XO-freq
within this important freq-band
which contains very valuable information for human ear
What you are saying, is that we should prefer
say 400 and 4000 XO
before 200 and 2000.
I will have this in mind, and do some practical tries
to see what I prefer.
I will have to try and find Mid that can work well
With such a XO-freq, I will on the other hand
have a much wider choice on the tweeter
(need not so super low FS)
halo - can speak, but also listen
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