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Old 20th November 2013, 10:06 AM   #9901
fas42 is online now fas42  Australia
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This album, Hound Dog Taylor: A Tribute - Various Artists | Songs, Reviews, Credits, Awards | AllMusic, is as good as any for seeing whether a system has "balls". Very well recorded, this has energy to burn - it's 'house-rocking' music - and ideally you should be able to turn it up until you can feel the walls bouncing on their foundations, , and the sound should still remain pristinely clear ...
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Frank the truth is, I just like a bit of ASMR ...
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Old 20th November 2013, 01:22 PM   #9902
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Originally Posted by boldname View Post
The good news is that there is also an emergence of simple recording with the excellent (digital) results which even comes over on high quality radio FM or Web.
True! Do you have any examples you can point to that I can download?
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Old 20th November 2013, 03:58 PM   #9903
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Originally Posted by POOH View Post
True! Do you have any examples you can point to that I can download?
You may be able to download:

For FM radio try BBC Radio 3 from their website or ? satellite if you can receive that. Uncompressed AAC +. They do live concerts at various venues. The country venues ones are often the best due to simple mic layouts etc. Often lunchtime broadcasts of chamber music from Wigmore Hall live FM wow. Good system 'you are there' sound. Plenty of other stuff.


Try Linn Audio, who are based in Scotland who allow snippets of various genre with excellent quality in FLAC studio quality downloads grading down to CD 16/44.1 to MP3.
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Old 21st November 2013, 12:12 AM   #9904
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Thanks, those are good links. I listen a lot to online radio through Audiles or Songbird. I can get like 60 thousand channels now - been introduced to all kinds of stuff - try the flac downlod here for something different and great sound

https://archive.org/details/Complex_Silence_40
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Old 21st November 2013, 08:35 AM   #9905
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Thanks, those are good links. I listen a lot to online radio through Audiles or Songbird. I can get like 60 thousand channels now - been introduced to all kinds of stuff - try the flac downlod here for something different and great sound

https://archive.org/details/Complex_Silence_40
Its great that you can use it all over there. Mindblowing
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Old 21st November 2013, 08:45 PM   #9906
pooge is offline pooge  United States
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Lynn,

I like to ask why you chose to make a custom LeCleac'h horn instead of, say, a 340Hz "off-the-shelf" horn. I surmise that you wanted to get the acoustic centers of the drivers closer together, but would like to hear your rationale.
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Old 22nd November 2013, 12:44 AM   #9907
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The AH425 had to: use a T ratio optimized for the most uniform diaphragm loading (based on sims, this turned out to be 0.707 or thereabouts), an entrance angle matched to the Altec 288 (or Radian 745), and fit in an Australian post box for shipping to the USA. FedEx or DHL from Oz to Denver is around $500 to $700, way too much for shipping.

The costs of wood horns made in the USA was astronomical, several times what Martin was quoting. Most of the US builders only wanted to build conicals or Tractrix; neither profile interests me. Since nobody in the USA would build what I wanted, at a price I would pay, I commissioned Martin to build the first pair of AH425's for me.

A 340 Hz off-the-shelf LeCleac'h would be an excellent choice provided it had a T=0.707 (T=0.8 would be fine) and an entrance angle that matched the Altec 288 or Radian 745. Again, no interest in a conical or Tractrix, no matter whether the horn is made of wood, fiberglass, or carbon-fiber. The selection of horn profile, combined with accuracy in matching the exit of the compression driver, is more important than the construction material.

My attitude towards spending moola on hifi might puzzle some: I splash around $3000 to $5000 for the parts for the Karna, an equal amount for the drivers for the new speaker, yet balk at $500 for shipping from Australia.

I see the shipping money as wasted. I feel the same way about a DAC or linestage that's all solid-state and costs $9000 or more. I know what solid-state parts cost: not much, from a few cents to a few dollars. Even something as complex as an iPhone only costs Apple about $190 in parts cost ... audiophile solid-state manufacturing costs are less than an iPhone, and the cost-to-sales-price ratio is far higher than Apple's 1:3.5 ratio. I'll pay Apple's prices because I like their software; how much software is in a DAC, linestage, or power amplifier?

Vacuum tubes, transformers, and Alnico-magnet drivers cost a lot because they are small production runs and are labor-intensive. When Bud Purvine of O-Netics charges $600 for an output transformer, it takes him about 4 to 6 hours to build it. That's an entirely fair price for his time and experience, and Bud's a professional in the industry that I want to support.

I am less sympathetic to products made on production lines with inexpensive parts that also have 4-color ads in magazines. I'm paying for that ad, and possibly bribing a corrupt reviewer (it happens, you know). No thanks, that's a part of the industry I do not want to support.

Last edited by Lynn Olson; 22nd November 2013 at 01:11 AM.
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Old 22nd November 2013, 03:59 AM   #9908
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Originally Posted by boldname View Post
Its great that you can use it all over there. Mindblowing
I know, I've been streaming for a couple of years now either through my horns or through my STAX headphones.

Here's one that has excellent bass detail at 320 KBS - WARNING don't try this on your direct radiator boxes you'll miss half the music!

https://archive.org/details/ClaudioN...adaEsParaTodos

Nice collection http://www.acustronica.com/artists.html

Last edited by POOH; 22nd November 2013 at 04:25 AM.
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Old 22nd November 2013, 04:40 AM   #9909
pooge is offline pooge  United States
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lynn Olson View Post
The AH425 had to: use a T ratio optimized for the most uniform diaphragm loading (based on sims, this turned out to be 0.707 or thereabouts), an entrance angle matched to the Altec 288 (or Radian 745), and fit in an Australian post box for shipping to the USA. FedEx or DHL from Oz to Denver is around $500 to $700, way too much for shipping.

The costs of wood horns made in the USA was astronomical, several times what Martin was quoting. Most of the US builders only wanted to build conicals or Tractrix; neither profile interests me. Since nobody in the USA would build what I wanted, at a price I would pay, I commissioned Martin to build the first pair of AH425's for me.

A 340 Hz off-the-shelf LeCleac'h would be an excellent choice provided it had a T=0.707 (T=0.8 would be fine) and an entrance angle that matched the Altec 288 or Radian 745. Again, no interest in a conical or Tractrix, no matter whether the horn is made of wood, fiberglass, or carbon-fiber. The selection of horn profile, combined with accuracy in matching the exit of the compression driver, is more important than the construction material.

My attitude towards spending moola on hifi might puzzle some: I splash around $3000 to $5000 for the parts for the Karna, an equal amount for the drivers for the new speaker, yet balk at $500 for shipping from Australia.

I see the shipping money as wasted. I feel the same way about a DAC or linestage that's all solid-state and costs $9000 or more. I know what solid-state parts cost: not much, from a few cents to a few dollars. Even something as complex as an iPhone only costs Apple about $190 in parts cost ... audiophile solid-state manufacturing costs are less than an iPhone, and the cost-to-sales-price ratio is far higher than Apple's 1:3.5 ratio. I'll pay Apple's prices because I like their software; how much software is in a DAC, linestage, or power amplifier?

Vacuum tubes, transformers, and Alnico-magnet drivers cost a lot because they are small production runs and are labor-intensive. When Bud Purvine of O-Netics charges $600 for an output transformer, it takes him about 4 to 6 hours to build it. That's an entirely fair price for his time and experience, and Bud's a professional in the industry that I want to support.

I am less sympathetic to products made on production lines with inexpensive parts that also have 4-color ads in magazines. I'm paying for that ad, and possibly bribing a corrupt reviewer (it happens, you know). No thanks, that's a part of the industry I do not want to support.
I see. It was about practical availabilty.

I understand the desired T=.7 spec. And I understand the need to match the exit angle of a desired driver. However, if a pancake driver like the jbl2451 was used, it has no throat having an exit angle to match.

That being said, while a T=.7 is desirable for the low end near Fc, the nature of that parameter pinches the throat and, I believe, narrows the high frequency spread. There must be an entrance angle as a desired parameter that benefits high frequency dispersion that provides good imaging in a desirably wide sweet spot. I guess if the multiple parameters of Fc, T, and throat radius don't jive for good entrance angle that provides for good dispersion at high frequencies, you just have to xover to a tweeter at the necessary frequency to match the polar of the mid horn.

Last edited by pooge; 22nd November 2013 at 04:51 AM.
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Old 22nd November 2013, 05:25 AM   #9910
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A 340 Hz off-the-shelf LeCleac'h would be an excellent choice provided it had a T=0.707 (T=0.8 would be fine) and an entrance angle that matched the Altec 288 or Radian 745.
The 340Hz Le Cleac'h horn that I make (and I chose 340 as a good number based on a 600mm mouth with full roll back - the commission was for a Vitavox S2 driver) has a wall angle (one side to axis) of 6 degrees with 1.4" throat. T=0.8. Unfortunately it can't be posted by Auspost either with the full roll back or 510mm mouth diameter. However well worth checking out online courier services - something that has come on a lot.

I pay half to the fibreglass shop to do the layup, and take half for myself, to do throats, flanges and finishing. Not sure how many hours I put into it, best not to think, but I still enjoy it - satisfying to make a product from raw materials in this day and age, and happy if I have done something to help bring Jean-Michel's expansion into the mainstream. Not to mention a self funding hobby :-).

Probably this looks like self promotion, but I never set out to make horns (except a pair for myself) - it was from the beginning always the result of commissions. I think now that there is a good Polish manufacturing facilty - autotech - an 'off the shelf' horn' is a real choice. I always expected a Chinese JMLC horn to appear but the market must be too small. I guess there will not be a JMLC pro horn because pro-sound wants constant directionality - though I think this is a mistake as a small venue might greatly benefit in the same way as a listening room. The horrible sound of the ubiquitous box on a pole could be so easily improved.

martin
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