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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 19th March 2013, 07:02 PM   #8441
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That is a 1.4" coil.
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Old 19th March 2013, 07:10 PM   #8442
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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Originally Posted by POOH View Post
... try the Dayton polymide 250 driver at Parts Express. It's around 50 dollars and sounds pretty darn nice down to 1200 HZ in a good horn.

then I would rather recommend the FaitalPro HF100

FaitalPRO | HF Drivers | HF100
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Old 19th March 2013, 07:15 PM   #8443
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manufacture says 1.5k and minumum 2K crossover with that i'd be careful about recommending that except for a treble driver, have you used it that low successfully? It only has a little 1" coil
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Old 19th March 2013, 07:28 PM   #8444
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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...... don't like the harsh sound typical of most horns.
I was reflecting on this part...and the low price

if you want to go cheap, and still have nice sound, I would suggest not xo/cross it low
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Old 20th March 2013, 09:48 PM   #8445
nuconz is offline nuconz  United States
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Originally Posted by tinitus View Post
I was reflecting on this part...and the low price

if you want to go cheap, and still have nice sound, I would suggest not xo/cross it low
so you mean don't cross it at x0, rather cross it about 3kc?

mcm carries this product.

Faital Pro 30W 8 Ohm - Bolt On Compre ion Tweeter Driver | HF100 | Faital Pro
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Old 20th March 2013, 10:09 PM   #8446
tinitus is offline tinitus  Europe
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so you mean don't cross it at x0, rather cross it about 3kc?
ehh, factory recommended min 2k is safety margin for PA
for hifi 2k should be very good

admittedly, I only have the old one, which might be a little different
but seem to work well with 8uf and 1ohm in series, and 1mH with 10ohm in paralel to ground

edit...looking at spec sheet graph, impedance ressonance starts rising just below 2khz, which might explain why I experience distortion with bigger caps, but with 8uf there is none, it seems
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Old 20th March 2013, 11:24 PM   #8447
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In my limited auditioning of potential 15" drivers, the modern GPA 416-Alnico-16ohm sounded much better than the contemporary JBL equivalent. But they're very different drivers: the JBL has a heavy cone, a 500-watt power rating and 4" voice-coil, and is obviously intended for theater and sound-reinforcement use, while the Altec cone is 25 grams lighter, the voice coil smaller, has a much lower power rating, and is about 2 to 3 dB more efficient.

What surprised me was how smooth the response of the GPA is: a broad, low-Q rise at 1.5 kHz, but well-controlled, with no narrowband peaking, and (very) smooth rolloff above that. Many of the modern 15" prosound drivers have pretty rough response above 1.5 kHz, and sound like it.

The GPA 416-Alnico-16ohms works very well with a 700 Hz 3rd-order Gaussian/Bessel lowpass filter, combined with a Zobel for inductance compensation. Very very smooth response, as good as any of the Scan-Speak audiophile confections, but with 12 dB more efficiency.

A 700 Hz 4th-order highpass, transitional between Bessel and Linkwitz-Riley, is close to the optimum filter for the Radian 745Neo & AH425 Azurahorn combination. Combine the GPA 416-Alnico with the Radian/Azurahorn, and the response in the 500 Hz to 3 kHz region is within +/- 1.5 dB, pretty good for a system that is around 99 dB/meter/watt efficient.

Thanks for the mention of the Celestion 1530; it'll be interesting to see how it compares (by measurement and audition) with the Alnico GPA 416.

Last edited by Lynn Olson; 20th March 2013 at 11:28 PM.
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Old 20th March 2013, 11:47 PM   #8448
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Lynn,
My only question about the GPA driver is why in this day they would use a 16ohm impedance unless they were expecting the driver to be used in a parallel condition with more than one driver? That is only going to raise the moving mass with the extra voicecoil weight unless that was an intention to lower the fs of the driver through extra mass and an overhung motor design.
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Old 21st March 2013, 02:01 AM   #8449
kevinh is offline kevinh  United States
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Lynn,
My only question about the GPA driver is why in this day they would use a 16ohm impedance unless they were expecting the driver to be used in a parallel condition with more than one driver? That is only going to raise the moving mass with the extra voicecoil weight unless that was an intention to lower the fs of the driver through extra mass and an overhung motor design.


16 Ohms can be a nice fit for a tube amp.
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Old 21st March 2013, 02:03 AM   #8450
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The GPA 416-Alnico is available in both 8 and 16 ohms; your choice when you order. The change in cone & VC mass is very small, most likely a few grams. Voice coils aren't that heavy in comparison to the cone. A bigger change in VC mass would probably result from 3-inch to 4-inch, which substantially increases the radiating area of the VC.

I chose 16 ohms because there is a possibility I will build a dual-15 version of the new speaker. 3 dB gain in efficiency, 6 dB gain in headroom, several dB drop in IM distortion, at the expense of a bigger (and heavier) cabinet. One driver might have a slightly different crossover than the other; if I build this version, I'd experiment with that.

As for tube amp vs transistor amp, this loudspeaker is optimized for tube amps: low-Q crossover and low-Q bass alignment that are not too sensitive to source impedance (damping factor). The design-center of the assumed source impedance for the loudspeaker is in the 0.5 to 1.5 ohm range.

Last edited by Lynn Olson; 21st March 2013 at 02:14 AM.
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