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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 27th September 2012, 03:27 PM   #8151
Pano is offline Pano  United States
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A friend of mine on Maui bought two pair (mid and tweeter) at my recommendation. He loves them. I have not been back out to hear them, but have seen a lot of measurements as we work on crossovers. They measure beautifully.
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Old 27th September 2012, 03:35 PM   #8152
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Hey Lynn,
Sounds like a fun filled, if smokey, trip. Glad you're feeling better. Did you get by to hear Gary's system this trip? I last heard it in 2009 when he went to the new woofers and single midrange. It's a beautiful system, super clean and so "right."

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And then I find out that the famous-name "genius" designer hired out the crossover design to an outside consultant
Ahhh.... that makes some sense of what I've experienced at shows. When I hear good crossover work, I compliment the designer. All of them will offer thanks, but few will talk about the crossovers. I thought "trade secrets" but maybe they don't elaborate because they didn't do the work!
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Old 27th September 2012, 05:59 PM   #8153
DeonC is offline DeonC  South Africa
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Hi Lynn

What will the minimal and optimal listening distances be for the LTO?

Thanks,
Deon
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Old 27th September 2012, 08:05 PM   #8154
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Based on what I've heard from the first prototypes, to my surprise, you can listen as close as two meters with surprisingly good integration between the 416 and the AH425. Personally, I would recommend 3 to 6 meters as optimum, with the arc between the speakers, as seen from the listening position, from 40 to 55 degrees. Put them too close together, there will be too much center information (crowded soundstage), put them too far apart, the center gets unstable and swimmy. Space them so the soundstage has a smooth and even energy distribution across the stereo panorama.

Even close-up, the new speakers sound like a very large electrostat, with the difference being a more "in-the-room" presentation than electrostats. If a typical electrostat sounds like the music extends behind the panel, say from the panel to 20 feet behind it, these speakers have sounds extending from the middle of the room (yes, nearly to your knees) to far behind the loudspeaker, subjectively 20 to 50 feet, depending on how 3D the recording is. But all recordings have a very noticeable sense of depth, even historical mono recordings. If there is studio-generated out-of-phase information on the recording, the out-of-phase sounds will extend in a 180-degree arc, directly to the right and left of the listener.

The level of the horn needs to be slightly re-adjusted for listening distance, since it has a higher directivity index (translation to English: it doesn't fall off with distance as fast as the 15" woofer).

Last edited by Lynn Olson; 27th September 2012 at 08:14 PM.
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Old 27th September 2012, 09:50 PM   #8155
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Is 15' x 15' room too small?
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Old 27th September 2012, 10:53 PM   #8156
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Default Maxfield Parrish

Before I moved to Colorado, I thought the skies in Maxfield Parrish paintings were gorgeous, but not something you'd ever see in real life. Well, maybe you don't see skies like that in the Pacific Northwest, but here in Colorado on certain special days, yes you do. And here's an example, taken with my Olympus OM-D about an hour ago:
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Old 27th September 2012, 10:56 PM   #8157
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Default More Maxfield Parrish

A little bit of Photoshop adjusting to the RAW file, but not much, and to align it with the visual impression. Here's another photo taken a few minutes earlier:

To answer the previous question, sure, a 15 x 15 foot room would be fine - that would be about 20% larger than the room where I heard the prototypes.
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File Type: jpg Cloudscape.jpg (192.7 KB, 607 views)

Last edited by Lynn Olson; 27th September 2012 at 11:11 PM.
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Old 27th September 2012, 11:13 PM   #8158
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What do Altecs sound like? Well, they're the auditory equivalent of a brilliant Colorado day minutes before a sudden storm. Sparkling. Vivid. Dynamic.

Yes, I heard not one, but TWO great systems on my trip. David Robinson's, editor of Positive Feedback Online, who had the all-up MBL system (preamp, amp, and speakers) with an astonishing front end: a USB DSD DAC that played both 1X DSD and even more remarkable, 2X DSD, all from a laptop with the most astonishing copies of mastertapes I've ever heard. All of your favorites, going back to the Seventies and Sixties, but in fidelity that was indistinguishable from an Ampex ATR-100 playing the original mastertape - not a second-generation copy. Many recordings that I had thought had screwed-up mastertapes were crystal clear, and revealed a level of artistry from the performers that I didn't know they had. More to be shown by David at the Rocky Mountain Festival in a couple of weeks.

Gary Pimm had a DAW-based system with J River software playing the 44.1/16 and 88.2/24 files, routed through a software rack that had third-party VST plug-ins for crossover and equalization functions. An Echo Layla with modified analog electronics took care of the DAC conversion. As usual, the sound was great, but I told Gary, "Go Alnico, man, you won't go back, trust me on this". Since he's got a pair of Altec 604's and a pair of Electro-Voice 15's in his basement, he can just try a pair of each and see which he likes best. Or better yet, swap the 604's, which are very very difficult to design crossovers for, for a pair of 416's with Alnico magnets. He'd probably come out ahead in the trade, and the 416's are way better than anything from Eminence.

The low and infra-bass from Gary's system is the best I've ever heard, bar none. We were playing the soundtrack from the London Olympics opening ceremony, and the sound of that giant bell shook the whole house. Crystal clear stop-starts, not like subwoofer bass at all, and an unlimited sense of power. Pretty amazing.

Last edited by Lynn Olson; 27th September 2012 at 11:42 PM.
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Old 28th September 2012, 11:31 PM   #8159
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Thanks for the report, Lynn. Yep, those subs of Gary's are amazing.

Speaking of amazing - I spent an amazing day today on the company of Don Keele and Tom Danley. Both of whom had brought their speaker to listen to. Never thought I 'd get the chance to hear the Keele CBT and the Danley Synergy horns side by side. But I did. It was a real treat. Wish you could have been there, Lynn.
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Old 28th September 2012, 11:53 PM   #8160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pano View Post
Thanks for the report, Lynn. Yep, those subs of Gary's are amazing.

Speaking of amazing - I spent an amazing day today on the company of Don Keele and Tom Danley. Both of whom had brought their speaker to listen to. Never thought I 'd get the chance to hear the Keele CBT and the Danley Synergy horns side by side. But I did. It was a real treat. Wish you could have been there, Lynn.
Well played, Sir! How'd ya pull that one off?

Greg

PS, you can't throw something like that out in the wind and not expect a million questions about how it sounded....jeez.
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