Beyond the Ariel - Page 598 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Multi-Way

Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 19th July 2009, 01:04 PM   #5971
mige0 is offline mige0  Austria
diyAudio Member
 
mige0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Austria, at a beautiful place right in the heart of the Alps.
Quote:
Originally posted by skorpion
Hi Michael,

Thanks for your reply.

I would in the spirit of your answer say that my understanding of what I see, hear or read is usually good enough. That's why I wrote the comment.

/Erling

Ok then, fine.

As for the pictures you requested :
No pix for now, just the CAD drawings shown that reflect the basic form and are also meant as an inspiration for any DIY. All the design work for beauty and WAV will be delayed until the core of the acoustic design roughly meets my expectations.
There still is some "slight room for improvement" in refinement of the overall system but also and especially for the dipole horn layout that's high in my list of "to do's" right now.


Michael
  Reply With Quote
Old 20th August 2009, 10:09 PM   #5972
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Well I can report I have a pair of GPA 288-H and Azurahorn AH-425 working and I'm finding the combination addictive to the point that Lynn's Ariel speakers are sidelined !!
...this despite the 750-8500Hz bandwidth .
Playlist restricted...guitar music sounds sensational . Leo Kottke rules !
Planning to add Aurum Cantus G3 ribbons v. soon .
Dave Slagle working on autoformers to match the horn to the ribbons, right now .
More soon, but don't hold your breath with my current workrate .
Onken cabs with Supravox 285GMF will be the foundation .

Mark J
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2009, 12:29 AM   #5973
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Results of the Azura horn and Altec 288 combo are now up on my site:
http://sites.google.com/site/driverv...ura-425hz-horn
http://sites.google.com/site/driverv...-altec-288-16h
__________________
~Brandon
DriverVault Soma Sonus Old Driver Tests
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2009, 03:04 AM   #5974
cuibono is offline cuibono  United States
diyAudio Member
 
cuibono's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: City of Angles
Augerpro, thanks again for the measurements! The horn looks beautiful - any idea what shipping is to the US for them?

I had a question though - I'll state firstly that I know very little about horns, and have no experience with them, although I'd love to try them sometime. The Azura horn looks really nice - the wife might not consider them a monstrosity But looking at the horn/drivers data, the frequency response isn't anywhere near flat, the nonlinear distortion looks high, and the impedance is way crazier than dynamic drivers. Is this supposed to be a good horn/driver?
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2009, 03:53 AM   #5975
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Seperating the horn from the driver, maybe I can answer your questions. The response-while not very smooth-behaves consistently as you move off axis. Maybe this is an effect of the Le'Cleach profile...But I think it points to the driver as the culprit. Since the peaks and dips never really change much it doesn't seem the horn is doing anything other than showing response of the driver itself. I'm hoping to get my standard DE250 with an adaptor on this by the end of the week and see what happens. Of course with three different profiles of the CD exit, adaptor, and horn entrance it may not bring all the answers we're looking for. They only concern I have is the way the horn dominates the impedance of the CD. The original impedance was bad, but with the horn attached it's still got issues even if they are not that provable of an impact.

As for the compression driver I'm sure there may be a reason why alnico is still so preferred. But I haven't found it. You just can't get around the fact these motors are old designs and the distortion is pretty high. I even tried looking at orders individually in the spectrum plots thinking maybe they make a lot low order but very little high order. But when the get pushed they make ALL teh orders so that's a dead end. And it's audible. From 400hz-800hz not only is spectrum lit up but you can hear it clear as day. You can here a raspy harshness that is loud enough that identifying the fundamental tone is immpossible. Vintage is cool, but GPA should form a new branch that uses modern methods to reduce distortion, but still using the alnico motor and those smooth soft parts.
__________________
~Brandon
DriverVault Soma Sonus Old Driver Tests
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2009, 04:26 AM   #5976
ScottG is offline ScottG  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: US
Quote:
Originally Posted by augerpro View Post
Seperating the horn from the driver, maybe I can answer your questions. The response-while not very smooth-behaves consistently as you move off axis. Maybe this is an effect of the Le'Cleach profile...But I think it points to the driver as the culprit. Since the peaks and dips never really change much it doesn't seem the horn is doing anything other than showing response of the driver itself. I'm hoping to get my standard DE250 with an adaptor on this by the end of the week and see what happens. Of course with three different profiles of the CD exit, adaptor, and horn entrance it may not bring all the answers we're looking for. They only concern I have is the way the horn dominates the impedance of the CD. The original impedance was bad, but with the horn attached it's still got issues even if they are not that provable of an impact.

As for the compression driver I'm sure there may be a reason why alnico is still so preferred. But I haven't found it. You just can't get around the fact these motors are old designs and the distortion is pretty high. I even tried looking at orders individually in the spectrum plots thinking maybe they make a lot low order but very little high order. But when the get pushed they make ALL teh orders so that's a dead end. And it's audible. From 400hz-800hz not only is spectrum lit up but you can hear it clear as day. You can here a raspy harshness that is loud enough that identifying the fundamental tone is immpossible. Vintage is cool, but GPA should form a new branch that uses modern methods to reduce distortion, but still using the alnico motor and those smooth soft parts.
Thanks Brandon!

Good measurements and synopsis.

I think the ND1460A is potentially the "right" 1.4" exit driver.

That horn is fantastic. Usable to pretty low freq.s/low order crossover for a horn AND with only a modest decrease in spl off-axis at upper freq.s (..relative to the lower freq.s).

BTW, nice find with that Celestion driver! (.."budget" doesn't have to mean "cheap".)
__________________
perspective is everything
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2009, 04:58 AM   #5977
CLS is offline CLS  Taiwan
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Taiwan
The measurements of that Azura horn look quite "CD" to me

How interesting!
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2009, 07:41 AM   #5978
CLS is offline CLS  Taiwan
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Taiwan
Quote:
Originally Posted by ScottG View Post
...

I think the ND1460A is potentially the "right" 1.4" exit driver.

...
Hi,

Why is that?

The published FR shows larger and larger rises and falls above 10kHz. And it looks a periodic trend, no? The impedance is very flat, though.

The NSD1480N looks smoother in the FR, only with a 'hiccup' at about 13~14k which is also shown in the impedance.

Of course those are only a part of the story and I'm looking forward to see the more thorough evaluations and tests.....
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2009, 04:52 PM   #5979
ScottG is offline ScottG  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: US
Quote:
Originally Posted by CLS View Post
Hi,

Why is that?

The published FR shows larger and larger rises and falls above 10kHz. And it looks a periodic trend, no? The impedance is very flat, though.

The NSD1480N looks smoother in the FR, only with a 'hiccup' at about 13~14k which is also shown in the impedance.

Of course those are only a part of the story and I'm looking forward to see the more thorough evaluations and tests.....
Mylar suspension for Al vs. a titanium suspension for the Ti. Lower fs for the Al vs. the Ti. Likely less non-linear distortion on the low end of the Al makes the driver's operation less critical. Should give a better developed subjective sense of depth and "3d" imaging (..though of course this is speculation). (..note that the 1" exit Ti nitride from 18 Sound does not have a titanium suspension.)
__________________
perspective is everything

Last edited by ScottG; 31st August 2009 at 04:55 PM.
  Reply With Quote
Old 31st August 2009, 06:22 PM   #5980
diyAudio Member
 
Speedskater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Lakewood, Ohio
Where is Lynn Olson? Is he well? I don't think that he has visited the forum in over a month.
__________________
Kevin
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:42 PM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2