1.2 to 1.5 meter behind in my OAK listening room, but a good 3 meters now in the MARBLE listening room (maybe 8000 kilo marble for floor and walls).
But there are no harshness, hardness or digitalis even completely un-damped.
Carpets pluss furniture on the way in however...
Ray AKA "Pablo Eskabar"....!
Ray,
.... 8 Tonnes of marble in one room...
Oak in the other
Furniture and carpet on its way ( from South America??!!)
Suddenly I wonder who it is I might be visiting....if I don't like the system will the last words I ever hear be " A last request Gringo"!!LOL
D.
Ray,
.... 8 Tonnes of marble in one room...
Oak in the other
Furniture and carpet on its way ( from South America??!!)
Suddenly I wonder who it is I might be visiting....if I don't like the system will the last words I ever hear be " A last request Gringo"!!LOL
D.
Not terribly different to the PD2150 ripole array I suggested to another.
(..though the air compression of the ripole does effectively add mass and lower efficiency).I think Bert Doppenburg (Netherlands) originally had a bass horn and then moved onto an array. Not sure if the array had low Qe drivers or not though.
..hmm, Ray the "bell maker" in Romancing The Stone?
I've seen his photo's of the Heil-types he's done: fantastic work!
(..but if I remember correctly the room they were being worked on was more cabin than estate. )
I suspect he was still working on the room at the time he took the pic..
-I mean, if you've got awesome DIY skills, why limit yourself to audio equipment?
Nice room and view here:
http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/full-range/156466-one-only-full-range-amt-5.html
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Not terribly different to the PD2150 ripole array I suggested to another.
I think Bert Doppenburg (Netherlands) originally had a bass horn and then moved onto an array. Not sure if the array had low Qe drivers or not though.
An array makes sense. Ticks more boxes for me than a horn. Less unknown unknowns to quote. R
I think Bert Doppenburg (Netherlands) originally had a bass horn and then moved onto an array. Not sure if the array had low Qe drivers or not though.
A horn is harder to build and ship and in turn harder for him to sell. I saw that dipole with the short front horn he promotes. Here he can claim it's a horn and not have to actually build or ship one. Can't blame him for that, how many people wanna pay the price for a real horn?
..hmm, Ray the "bell maker" in Romancing The Stone?
In the ´80´s and ´90´s I was traveling around and visited many great concert buildings.. Many of those was made of stone and in the Marmor Saal in Salzburg I experienced one of the best acoustic and best audio performances.
So when I was restoring an old wine cellar I got the idea to make my own miniature marmor Saal. It was also great fun to discover that marble was cheaper in 20 and 30 mm than 10 mm..
I tested the acoustics in the room first with some box speakers and that was a boomy and standing wave experience, but with the dipoles that transformed to acoustics resembling the experiences from Salzburg.
Absolutely no ringing effects from the marble, and it is great fun when music with a lot of LF energy are played at 100dB as nothing in the room shakes or rattles or moves, and the huge differences between recordings are revealed.
Room Acoustics
Ray,
Wow...
" I tested the acoustics in the room first with some box speakers and that was a boomy and standing wave experience, but with the dipoles that transformed to acoustics resembling the experiences from Salzburg. "
That's a bit of a revelation to me, really points to the inherent superiority of open baffle loudspeaker designs.
Cheers
Derek.
Ray,
Wow...
" I tested the acoustics in the room first with some box speakers and that was a boomy and standing wave experience, but with the dipoles that transformed to acoustics resembling the experiences from Salzburg. "
That's a bit of a revelation to me, really points to the inherent superiority of open baffle loudspeaker designs.
Cheers
Derek.
I would put it like this: we are still well away from universal understanding that every aspect of a system bears upon the quality of the audible result - acoustic reality was achieved decades ago, but it's still a very hit and miss affair achieving it ...
I'd say : thats impossible. There is a unlimited way of sound propagation, in the most diverse acoustic environments, and ways of recording. How will a listener at home know, what exactly was recorded at the life event, or in the studio, and be able to compare with his hifi setup results ? Sometimes we see at hifi shows life bands playing. Its recorded, and then reproduced at the same place. If we'd make a high quality record of the event, and then reproduce it at the same place with speakers like MBL radialstrahler, with extremely low distortion, then we could may be have a fairly accurate reproduction at the same place. But reproduce the same recording at home, with completely different sound propagation and reflections due to the room walls, a completely different perception is the result.
What we will see in the future, is what we see today: the development of new kind of ways to exitate air particles, to emit sound , but these ways will never have the ability to reproduce in a close 1:1 fashion the experience in a opera hall, and a rock concert at the same time. We have come quite far in reproduce the illusion of a recording at home, with its very own ability to create emotion, pleasure, relax and fun with its intrinsic and idiosyncratic sound behavior. That's how far it can get, and its great.
Why would we want to? Reality is overrated. Playing around with horns I can paint the scene with my own palette of colours and shapes.
A studio album is often a mix of thousands of clips recorded with mic preamps and compressors with opamps in them. Then we have the ever so popular virtual effects (VST) that makes life as a recording engineer so much easier, but reduces sound quality. A live concert is not much better as it is often amplified by Chinese Behringer equipment and then EQd to death by the sound technician.
They have even begun to ruin the natural roar of a soccer audience by amplifying the roar with strategically placed PA speakers.
A studio album is often a mix of thousands of clips recorded with mic preamps and compressors with opamps in them. Then we have the ever so popular virtual effects (VST) that makes life as a recording engineer so much easier, but reduces sound quality. A live concert is not much better as it is often amplified by Chinese Behringer equipment and then EQd to death by the sound technician.
They have even begun to ruin the natural roar of a soccer audience by amplifying the roar with strategically placed PA speakers.
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The point is not to achieve a 'perfect copy', but to recreate the subjective impact of the performance. Most audio systems no matter how expensive scream "fake, fake!!", especially when you push the volume to realistic levels - a very small minority can project an extremely convincing simulation at times ... this is a goal worth pursuing ...
Unbelievable ... !
, ... these sound engineers, once you give them a few toys to play with, they just can't stop fiddling with the bloody things !!The very best comparisons of live versus recorded as a planned comparison with the best the very best recording and playback shows something is lost in the recording replay process. Even a guitar played back through its amp and speaker beats the recorded and replayed original.
Too many assume that modern electronics can overcome this. It is too complex to repeat exactly the same reproduction in the same position as sat the piano or guitar.
Does it matter. probably not. Does it give enjoyment. Well I say it does.
I will stop there.
Marble wall or just a brick wall. Is it not true that one wall is supposed to be hard like stone, and another covered with QSC diffusors, bass traps in the corner and absorption panels on some walls, floor and ceiling? Those QSC diffusors are very much recommended by the way. Not on every wall, just one or two.
From a subjective point of view this is nonsense. I have achieved this level of quality many times, I'm well aware what's possible - and it can happen for a live Hendrix performance, and a full blown operatic production ... through the same piece of kit.
Biggest problem is achieving intensity of sound - the live drum kit in your lounge room thing - with cleanness ... this is where really hard, and detailed, work refining a system does wonders ...