Beyond the Ariel - Page 30 - diyAudio
Go Back   Home > Forums > Loudspeakers > Multi-Way

Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

Please consider donating to help us continue to serve you.

Ads on/off / Custom Title / More PMs / More album space / Advanced printing & mass image saving
Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 16th April 2007, 11:14 AM   #291
diyAudio Member
 
Stephen R's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Folkestone
Completely OT

Variac. You got the coolest guy on the web as your avatar. Homestar rules!!!
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2007, 03:22 PM   #292
Variac is offline Variac  United States
diyAudio Editor
 
Variac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: San Francisco, USA
OK, I agree that to make a coax with a ribbon is a tall order. I guess I was influenced by Lynn saying his fallback position was to use a ribbon with a large pro driver. It is hard to get a large enough ribbon to fit, AND it is true- you don't want to push the things. On the other hand, I use a small ribbon down to 4.5 khz and it sounds great- basically my speakers are the 8" with ribbon and large pro woofer option that Lynn says is the obvious solution, but that doesn't have the impact he is looking for. I can believe this, mine is a bit thin compared to what he is describing.

As Lynn said in the beginning, he seems most interested in a coax driver with a horn. Taming the horn is the challenge but if the proposed methods work then it could be amazing.

So, if we focus back on the coax, the Hemp Acoustics seems to be a must listen. Basically we are burning up time here - in a good way- getting lots of info- until the HA drivers are available.

As Lynn mentioned, working with a manufacturer closely is a very efficient process. HA has been able to do this, and since their intention is to produce a coax HiFi speaker, its seems that they are very likely to do a good job. Most home horn systems are adapting pro hardware for a different purpose: home hifi. The HA people are able to work directly with the manufacturer to make the driver work in the home context. This does make the comparison to Tannoy reasonably valid. If one does a search of all the pro co-ax drivers available , it's overwhelming- there are at least 25 out there easily available, and when you consider mixing and matching different horn drivers for the coax's that allow this, it is a lot of choices.

Probably we should all send Lynn $100 so that he can order all of the pro coax's out there!! Then he could listen to and measure just the bass cone without the tweeter on, and determine the "best". Then mix and match the horn drivers until he gets the right combo... I don't know if this could happen, but if it could, it would happen here.

This is another example, as mentioned above, that a company has some advantages over us- like that ordering $15,000 worth of drivers isn't that big a deal!

The hobbyist advantage is that we can take a great product and make it better, because we have the time to sweat the details. The various ways mentioned that can control standing waves and diffraction are examples of what we can work with.

Another example is the idea of opening the back of the horn driver. That is a pretty exciting idea, not only giving us a dipole, but also changing the damping of the driver maybe. If we played around with the idea and it worked well, I'm sure that someone would pop up that could make a custom backplate with a built -in rear horn if it were required for loading or volume. Probably owners could just modify the existing backplate with an opening. Or Hemp Acoustics might be convinced to make it an option on their open baffle driver.

Hemp Acoustics is introducing a lot of products at the same time so it is understandable that it is taking a while. If their coax's are as good as we hope, they are worth supporting. As far as I can see, they are about the only manufacturer doing this for the home market that is striving for the highest quality.

IMHO they should speed a pair to Lynn ASAP!



Homestar Runner avatar? yup It's the coolest!
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2007, 03:44 PM   #293
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Costa Rica
Send a message via AIM to johninCR Send a message via MSN to johninCR Send a message via Yahoo to johninCR
HA is a little too proud of their stuff pricewise. They told me $600 for the coax, so I laughed and passed.
__________________
Everyone has a photographic memory. It's just that most are out of film.
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2007, 04:27 PM   #294
Variac is offline Variac  United States
diyAudio Editor
 
Variac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: San Francisco, USA
For a top quality unit I don't think that's out of line, and hey- you get 2 drivers! Is that for the 12"?

I thought that they wanted over a thousand for the 15".

We've gotten some great group buys in the past, from the likes of Cardas and other high end brands. Who knows? maybe a one time introductory offer to DIY Audio members?
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2007, 05:05 PM   #295
diyAudio Member
 
mpmarino's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Crunchville, where I don't fit in.
I saw a couple posts talking about dumping the compression driver in a coax and using the 'horn' to mount a ribbon -or other.

I was thinking about this too...

I was thinking of taking a tweeter like this one. Remove the rear chamber cover. Affix (seal) the rear of the tweeter to the horn and use the horn's internal volume as the tweeter rear chamber.

Maybe you could treat the sides and rear of the tweeter with a damping material and turn the edge of the tweeters waveguide/flange into 'swiss cheese' a la mamboni(?).
edit: or chuck it up in the lathe and take the flange right down
__________________
Crazy Yankee.
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2007, 05:21 PM   #296
chrisb is offline chrisb  Canada
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: victoria BC
Daryl Hawthorne ( Mr. Silver Iris) is currently polling for consensus on how to evolve the specs for higher end drivers with his moniker.

He has a well established business arrangement with Eminence, and has sold many more than 100pairs of drivers, to very satisfied DIYers in over 17 countries, including I believe some posters to this thread.

Rather than wait for HA to ramp up production of their new coax drivers, why not enjoin him in this endeavor? As has been noted, with appropriate minimum orders, Eminence engineers are more than happy to assist in meeting custom specifications. They certainly have a reputation for quality, value, reasonable production schedules, and customer service, all to a level that HA has yet to demonstrate.

I doubt very much that Daryl would object to any increase in his sales from such a custom spec'd driver.
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2007, 05:49 PM   #297
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Costa Rica
Send a message via AIM to johninCR Send a message via MSN to johninCR Send a message via Yahoo to johninCR
ChrisB,

While Eminence seems to run a tight ship schedule-wise, I've been waiting for the 10" coax that was expected to be out last July, so your comparison to HA is without full info. When Darrel comes out with something new, I'll be more than happy to give it a twirl. A group buy that I'd like to be part of would be trying to come up with something different and save money too, especially since it could eliminate an extra layer of profit.
__________________
Everyone has a photographic memory. It's just that most are out of film.
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2007, 05:52 PM   #298
Variac is offline Variac  United States
diyAudio Editor
 
Variac's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: San Francisco, USA
SI has certainly staked out a claim for HiFi consideration.

Here's the Eminence custom info:
http://www.eminence.com/custom.asp

HiFi buzzwords I like:

Do they really mean anything? I don't know...

Deltalite minimal basket with neodymium magnets
The weight savings alone for shipping covers the cost.
OK, could also consider Alnico magnets..
Hemp cone- that's trendy...
It would be very cool to be the first to get a Deltalite based coax.
But the Deltalites have a 2.5 " coil which is different than the beta coax has and they probably aren't interchangable.

There is only one basket made for coax I believe That's a steel one in the Beta line and the beta's have a 2" coil. That would probably be easy to rig with an Alnico magnet and hemp cone as they use that for their instrument speakers.


  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2007, 05:57 PM   #299
agent.5 is offline agent.5  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Francisco, CA
Quote:

Here's the Eminence custom info:
http://www.eminence.com/custom.asp [/B]


To qualify as an OEM, we require a minimum order of 50 pieces per spec as well as a copy of your resale tax certificate or business license.


I think we can easily do 50 pcs here, especially if John is taking 25.
  Reply With Quote
Old 16th April 2007, 06:10 PM   #300
agent.5 is offline agent.5  United States
diyAudio Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: San Francisco, CA
Quote:
Originally posted by Variac
For a top quality unit I don't think that's out of line, and hey- you get 2 drivers! Is that for the 12"?

I thought that they wanted over a thousand for the 15".

We've gotten some great group buys in the past, from the likes of Cardas and other high end brands. Who knows? maybe a one time introductory offer to DIY Audio members?
For various secondary sources, it is $600 MRSP for the 12" coaxial and $1200 MRSP for the 15" coaxial. Knowing that virtually nobody pays MRSP, street prices will be lower. And if we can pool a big order, we can aim right at wholesale price -- my guess will be around 1/2 of MRSP.
  Reply With Quote

Reply


Hide this!Advertise here!
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



New To Site? Need Help?

All times are GMT. The time now is 06:56 AM.


vBulletin Optimisation provided by vB Optimise (Pro) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2014 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Copyright 1999-2014 diyAudio

Content Relevant URLs by vBSEO 3.3.2