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Multi-Way Conventional loudspeakers with crossovers

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Old 30th August 2015, 07:33 PM   #13551
Rewind is offline Rewind  Sweden
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Originally Posted by daanve View Post
Pooh and Rewind: take some reading lessons please.
To my regret this thread becomes more and more polluted.
I misread and it was "120hz up to 1.2khz", not 120Hz-8kHz for the JBL 2206. Sry about the confusion. Still, 1200Hz for a 12" is too high for my taste and more of a PA or guitar cabinet. I really wanted to believe this myth of JBL 12" to have such crisp midrange, and tried JBL E-120 and JBL 2202, but it doesn't compare to a Saba Greencone 8", or a good compression driver in a midrange horn (500-6500Hz). BTW, the 2225 is fantastic and more useful than a my JBL 12" E-120 because it goes lower and sounds almost as good in lower midrange. I tested now, and the 2206 in a vented cabinet goes almost as low as a 2225 in a simulation in WinISD. Maybe not in the real world.

If you have something with high detail that can take over around 500Hz, the 2225 is great. Not for horn though, here I prefered the 2220 when comparing only the two.

Last edited by Rewind; 30th August 2015 at 07:46 PM.
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Old 30th August 2015, 09:09 PM   #13552
g3dahl is offline g3dahl  United States
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Yesterday a bunch of Seattle-area audio enthusiasts braved wild windstorms and power outages to attend the biannual DIY Showcase, co-hosted by Pacific Northwest Audio Society and Sound DIY. It seemed to be a nice opportunity for my speakers to be heard by a larger number of listeners. The rented cargo van had lots of space, so I brought a complete system, using my server as a source.

Click the image to open in full size.

The server runs JRiver MC20 connected via USB to the exaSound e20 mk ii, the latter's balanced outputs feeding the Amity amplifiers. The Amity amps drive the 416's, 745's and RAALs. The subs are driven by their own plate amps.

By the way, further efforts to integrate the RAAL Lazy Ribbons have been quite successful. In listening comparisons (ribbons vs no ribbons), everyone preferred the ribbons.

Happy listeners shown below...

Click the image to open in full size.

Gary Dahl
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Old 31st August 2015, 12:39 AM   #13553
mayhem13 is offline mayhem13  United States
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Originally Posted by Rewind View Post
I misread and it was "120hz up to 1.2khz", not 120Hz-8kHz for the JBL 2206. Sry about the confusion. Still, 1200Hz for a 12" is too high for my taste and more of a PA or guitar cabinet. I really wanted to believe this myth of JBL 12" to have such crisp midrange, and tried JBL E-120 and JBL 2202, but it doesn't compare to a Saba Greencone 8", or a good compression driver in a midrange horn (500-6500Hz). BTW, the 2225 is fantastic and more useful than a my JBL 12" E-120 because it goes lower and sounds almost as good in lower midrange. I tested now, and the 2206 in a vented cabinet goes almost as low as a 2225 in a simulation in WinISD. Maybe not in the real world.

If you have something with high detail that can take over around 500Hz, the 2225 is great. Not for horn though, here I prefered the 2220 when comparing only the two.
Never tried the Saba drivers but I have spent much time with large format midrange horns, the classic greats in installed systems......and I would respectfully disagree with your position on them for home use in other than the more unusually large listening rooms at long distances. The inTernal reflections in the 800-1200hz range at 12 ft distance are....for me.....easily recognizable.

I've considered crossing the 2206 lower at around 1k but honestly I can't hear anything objectionable at my listening levels and I have experienced objectionable qualities from 1" CDs playing any lower than the 1.2 cross I have now. The space plays a large part as well so our experiences might be farther apart than we think.
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Old 31st August 2015, 01:35 AM   #13554
FrankWW is offline FrankWW  Canada
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Originally Posted by Capt Grogg View Post
Bruno has a few other ventures: Kii Audio and Purfi

Bruno Putzeys
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Bruno Putzeys
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Antwerp Area, BelgiumConsumer Electronics
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Purifi, Hypex Electronics BV, Kii Audio GmbH
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Hypex Electronics BV, Grimm Audio, Philips
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Co-founded with Lars Risbo and Peter Lyngdorf. In skunkworks mode for the time being... Stay tuned...
Hey Captain! That Kii speaker looks like quite a piece. Constant directivity in cardioid implementation, 2 drivers front and back, 1 each side, six Hypex amps, ton of DSP, FB from voice coil, analogue, digital or wireless inputs, and in a package 20x40x40 cm.

Going to post it on that consolidated active speaker thread. Cluttering up Lynne's thread enough.

Regarding the value high end theme in previous post: If I understand the promotional bumpf, this is going to be much cheaper than that Grimm LS1. 10K Euro a pair & it's plug and play. Supply precedes demand and competition brings price down, even if the guy had to go with another co so he could compete with himself.

Question. We know what HT has done to audio. So what will happen to it when there's a holodeck in the living room, or even the back yard?

Linkwitz thinks Kii is worth watching
Constant directivity loudspeaker designs

Apparently they're going to have it at RMAF this Fall.
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Old 31st August 2015, 02:32 AM   #13555
ScottG is offline ScottG  United States
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Originally Posted by g3dahl View Post

Click the image to open in full size.



Gary Dahl


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Old 31st August 2015, 02:35 AM   #13556
ScottG is offline ScottG  United States
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Originally Posted by g3dahl View Post
..In listening comparisons (ribbons vs no ribbons), everyone preferred the ribbons..

Gary Dahl

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Old 31st August 2015, 02:59 AM   #13557
g3dahl is offline g3dahl  United States
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Thanks, Scott! It was nice meeting you. Were you around to hear the results when we replaced the 5687's in the power amps with René Jaeger's 7119's?

Gary Dahl
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Old 31st August 2015, 05:13 AM   #13558
Pano is offline Pano  United States
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Very cool Gary! You're a brave man to haul the whole system to a meet.
Wish I could have been there.
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Old 31st August 2015, 05:24 AM   #13559
vuki is offline vuki  Croatia
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Gary, I see they put you guys in appropriate room.
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Old 31st August 2015, 05:29 AM   #13560
Kindhornman is offline Kindhornman  United States
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Gary,
Nice work. Now if you could repackage it for some wife approval that would be nice! How many of those old guys could truly hear the ribbon top end. most looked pretty old except for a couple of younger guys?
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