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Old 8th October 2013, 04:00 AM   #11
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Originally Posted by paul burchell View Post
A true craftsman knows how to work wood and also how to work with wood, the number one rule is wood moves seasonally but only across the grain in any noticeable amount, so a box with 6 solid wood panels or 12 glue joints has 4 cross grain glue joints that are continuously under stress and will eventually fail
Airtight cabinets can be made out of solid wood, but the cross grain panels have to be screwed, not glued, using cork gaskets to allow for movement. It's been done for hundreds of years in pipe organ chests which had to be completely airtight and were built long before plywood existed.
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Old 8th October 2013, 09:11 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by EdKennedy View Post
Airtight cabinets can be made out of solid wood, but the cross grain panels have to be screwed, not glued, using cork gaskets to allow for movement. It's been done for hundreds of years in pipe organ chests which had to be completely airtight and were built long before plywood existed.
Thanks Ed i didn,t know the procedures used in the past and it is interesting to learn how it was done but, it still raises questions to me as a cabinet maker, as i said not a speaker builder after viewing a pic that showed a long rectangular tube glued together with mitres cut on the end ready to accept a mitred cap. So if screws where installed they should be some how elongated to allow for movement, but what would happen if these boxes where moved from say a typical northern climate to say the dessert or the tropics. the moisture content would fall or rise substantially causing sightly ugly miters or worst
To be fair some woods and some cuts (quarter sawn in particular)move far less, still they move which likely would be perfectly fine on the top of a pipe organ speaker thingy, and if you orient the mitered cap so that best quality wood we are using spans the the shortest joint you could keep an air tight joint but how pretty would it look on the top of your expensive prized speakers when cosmetic gaps come and go, or the speaker was assembled at the end of the dry season and expansion put constant pressure on the glue joint when it was moved to lets say the Louisiana. Do you really think it would last for generations.
There are way to many variables to say whether this would remain a structurally sound piece let alone a eye pleasing piece
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Old 9th October 2013, 01:35 PM   #13
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Paul, You are right. A cross grain miter is not the greatest idea, even if it is only a short one.
My question is why would you make a solid wood cabinet in a style that makes it look like it is veneer on flakeboard?
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Old 9th October 2013, 04:25 PM   #14
chrisb is offline chrisb  Canada
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Originally Posted by EdKennedy View Post
Paul, You are right. A cross grain miter is not the greatest idea, even if it is only a short one.
My question is why would you make a solid wood cabinet in a style that makes it look like it is veneer on flakeboard?

which is exactly what Paul's enclosures pictured earlier and his avatar don't look like - and frankly I doubt a close inspection of solid and veneers of the same species wouldn't immediately proclaim the difference - there's no substitute for the look of the real thing

That said, I think far fewer of us have the skill or patience to complete such a project, and have it hold up for decades. My junior high school wood shop African mahogany side table is now almost 50yrs old, but that included dovetail dadoes, pinned mortise and tenons, and top fitted with expansion / sliding blocks - I don't think I've built anything as complicated entirely in solid wood since.
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Old 9th October 2013, 11:56 PM   #15
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I didn't mean Paul's enclosures, I was referring to the Pearl speakers.
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Old 10th October 2013, 11:07 PM   #16
chrisb is offline chrisb  Canada
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So, Ed - you're saying that the Pearl enclosures look like veneer on flakeboard? I think a quick examination of the exposed edge and particularly end grain would disabuse anyone of that notion - sure there are some very nice real veneer edge tapes, but not that I'm aware of for end grain,

Moreover, I've yet to see even the highest quality of real wood veneers with a decent finish that would be mistaken for solid wood -particularly a species with deep pores such as the French oak used by Pearl.

Of course, I'd be interested to watch (although not participate in) a discussion on the statement:

The casings of all Pearl Acoustics enclosures are constructed from solid French Oak. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise – there is no better wood for making high quality loudspeakers. Since the 17th. Century the world’s finest organ builders have used slow grown, European oak for its neutral sound imaging and long-term structural stability.


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Old 11th October 2013, 01:08 PM   #17
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Chris, I said "in a style" that looks like veneer, meaning with sharp corners, totally flat panels, etc. I was not judging their choice of wood or quality of finishing.
I suppose I should have been clearer in my original posting.
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Old 11th October 2013, 08:22 PM   #18
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THE LAST WORD

I am confident that with the list of people involved in engineering the science of sound into the development of the speakers in question, it would no doubt have quit the wow factor to enthusiasts.
My opinion was based intirelly on the knowledge of wood. I have seen a few designs (furniture speaking) where the builder thought he could ignore the fact that wood is alive, until it turned and bit him in the ***.


To those interested there is a product I have used a few years ago, it involves kilning the s*** out of the wood down to about 2% moisture. The claim is that it collapses the wood fiber so it does not absorb water therefore it doesn,t move. I have worked with it, ONCE and dont particularly like it because of the fine mdf like dust, nor does it have the integrity for fine joinery but besides that who know.


Chris as you may or may not know, my son and I are building and designing speakers and such ,using solid wood mostly with veneered baffles. My son is currently putting together testing equipment (mics programs etc.) since we will be building from many different species the same box with the same driver, could this info be relevant for study or is the ear the only way to determine the acoustic value of different woods


If e-mails are preffered Contact Us ? Paul Burchell Woodworking
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Old 14th October 2013, 12:20 AM   #19
chrisb is offline chrisb  Canada
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Paul, I wasn't aware of your trade during your first few posts, but we are now all quite aware of your artisan-ship - it certainly surpasses the skill set that most of us posting here have when it comes to working with solid woods.

I note the (fairly new?) section of your website - gorgeous


Click the image to open in full size.



The results of your tests on building the same design with combinations of different materials will no doubt be of great interest - can there ever be too much data for the experts to chew over ?

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Old 18th February 2014, 10:55 PM   #20
Adam0 is offline Adam0  Belgium
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Originally Posted by Scottmoose View Post
Aye, although it's not exactly FH3, it's a revision of it specifically for the A7 done for Pearl. Haven't heard from them for a long time, so presumably they haven't sold anything. Not surprising given the economic conditions, as you say, and the absence of any marketing that I've seen.
Well here is a voice from the past! It's Harley Lovegrove, the technical director of Pearl Acoustics. Yes indeed we have been very quiet. In fact we're doing fine, it's just taking a lot longer to get fully up and running. We have been building speakers and storing them in different conditions, testing and retesting (French Oak can be tricky if in a too dry environment = cracks!) so we have been playing with the construction to be sure they'll be fine everywhere.
On top of this we have had VAT challenges (the cabinets are made in Belgium and need to be imported to the UK before being exported again to obtain the VAT deductions everyone needs).
But we are now setting up our distributor networks and obtaining reviews etc. So we expect to be beginning retailing in the early Summer 2014. The Sibelius has been fine, we now need to push start the lovely Valentini - it sounds great.
We are small but can produce up to thirty pairs a month, each one hand built using a very special technique to avoid any internal batterns or bracing or weak mitre joints. We are in a strong cash position, so we are not at all worried about the recession - if we only sell very small numbers, we are fine. If large orders come in, we are happy too. We expect to be around for the next decades - so we are not in any rush!
The site is still under construction but here is a link: Home Page we're also on facebook. see you there!
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