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-   -   MA 12.2P Pensil observation (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/markaudio/233537-ma-12-2p-pensil-observation.html)

sootboots 5th April 2013 11:55 PM

MA 12.2P Pensil observation
 
I have made an interesting observation regarding the performance of my Pensils. Up to now I had been using 300b mono blocs and the sound was pleasing most of the time. However, I took my amps to the shop to check the bias and run through the voltages, which I do from time to time out of boredom, and hooked the Pensils up to my Yamaha HT amp. Sound was OK but nowhere near as nice as with the SE tube amps. Then it occurred to me to turn up the bass as high as it would go (+10 something, dB maybe?) Voila! Deep, rich bass I had not heard in years. I know this is not an audiophile amplifier but the sound of the speakers is divine! I go directly from CD player to amp with just volume attenuation so I have no way to EQ when using the tube amps but it appears that my amps just don't have enough bass for my tastes. As an interim solution, I have a minidsp on the way and will try that as EQ. In the meantime, the 12.2 p Pensils are pure joy!

Still learning,
JP

wushuliu 6th April 2013 01:28 AM

Hm, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of feedback on this driver's sound qualities.

markaudio 6th April 2013 01:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wushuliu (Post 3442906)
Hm, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of feedback on this driver's sound qualities.

The thread starter was talking about amps so give him a chance to get comment on his subject matter, rather than pull the thread off-topic so soon.

There's a good deal of comment, use the forum's search function. I've just tried it and counted 200 posts relating to the 12P driver. Feel free to ask members who are using this driver.

Mark

vinylkid58 6th April 2013 01:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wushuliu (Post 3442906)
Hm, there doesn't seem to be a whole lot of feedback on this driver's sound qualities.

Seriously? Feedback regarding the A12p driver has been almost unanimously positive AFAIK. There's going to be the odd individual who doesn't like this particular driver for whatever reason, but you can't please everyone.

jeff

wushuliu 6th April 2013 02:03 AM

Whoa people. Easy. Everybody. Take. It. Easy.

thanks

markaudio 6th April 2013 02:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sootboots (Post 3442858)
I have made an interesting observation regarding the performance of my Pensils. Up to now I had been using 300b mono blocs and the sound was pleasing most of the time. However, I took my amps to the shop to check the bias and run through the voltages, which I do from time to time out of boredom, and hooked the Pensils up to my Yamaha HT amp. Sound was OK but nowhere near as nice as with the SE tube amps. Then it occurred to me to turn up the bass as high as it would go (+10 something, dB maybe?) Voila! Deep, rich bass I had not heard in years. I know this is not an audiophile amplifier but the sound of the speakers is divine! I go directly from CD player to amp with just volume attenuation so I have no way to EQ when using the tube amps but it appears that my amps just don't have enough bass for my tastes. As an interim solution, I have a minidsp on the way and will try that as EQ. In the meantime, the 12.2 p Pensils are pure joy!

Still learning,
JP

Hello JP, Guys,
There's been a good deal of debate over the years between the Mofset and the tube fellas. There's also a sort of "love hate" thing sometimes going on over how good (or bad) 300B amps perform. I have 2 300B's and love them. I also have 3 Japanese Vintage/classic Mofsets (Accuphase E308, Sansui Au-a-907DR and Sony TAF 333Ex). Could I choose between this lot? Very difficult. I sometimes like to "tweak" the bass gain on the Mofsets depending on the music I'm playing at the time. While other times, I'm into the sweetness of the 300B's, both amps have Mr. Zhu and Kenneth Wong handmade transformers - yummy.

I think its fairly typical to expect a lighter bass when using 300B's. Others might differ but this is my experience so far with the 2 amps I'm using.

Ozawa san (MJ Audio magazine - Japan) wants me to try an all Japan 2a3 amp soon as possible. Could be interesting.

For those guys wanting a bit more bass, the Markaudio drivers are "long throw" designs with compliant suspensions, coil winding lengths are significantly longer than most other full-range driver designs. Within reason (remembering they are light load drivers), you can extract more LF oscillation from these drivers. For those guys wishing to drive the LF response on a regular basis, the "A" (Arrestor) drivers are the better choice in the Markaudio family.

Cheers
Mark.

markaudio 6th April 2013 02:20 AM

Guys,
If, like me, you're into collecting vintage/classic amps (big boys toys thing), try and get your hands on this Sansui:

SANSUI ƒvƒŠƒƒCƒ“ƒAƒ“ƒvAU-ƒ907DR‚Žd—l ƒTƒ“ƒXƒC

I've got one of these amps, built like a battleship, weighing in a 33Kg (72.6lbs), expect a hernia each time you move it. This 907Dr was (I recollect) the first to have Sansui's Silent transformer technology, hence its weight. Very sweet clean tone from this amp. Sadly Sansui went bust in the mid 90's so these amps are growing in value. I'll take my credit cards with me on my next trip to Tokyo.

When using amps of this size on Markaudio drivers, go easy on the volume control. Drivers fitted with the Arrestor (A on their labels) will be preferable.

Cheers
Mark.

mp9 6th April 2013 02:24 AM

300B isn't particularly know for it's bass. I've had a entry level Audio Note 300B amp with wooly uncontrolled bass, and one by Wavelength Audio which held it together much better, allot depends on the circuit design, driver tube, opt's...

While i no longer have a 300B amp to try, so far i'm happy with the A12P bass driven by a 45 tube SET amp, and the speed is pretty darn excellent.

Also, you may want to look into the Bottlehead BeePre 300B preamp. It was designed for their 300B amp but also for use with others. The designer says it really helps with the bass. People are saying good things about it. I can't comment yet one way or the other. Will try to update after i finish building one, could be a while, i'm horrible at soldering. Fwiw, i honestly wasn't in the market for a preamp but the concept seemed so out there that i couldn't resist.

Bob Brines 6th April 2013 02:31 AM

I use the miniDSP when I am bi-amping, and it does a very good job for what it is. However, ADC is only running at 48kHz, and the chip is getting long in the tooth. I am wondering if this will fit with the mystic of the 300B. On the other hand, the mystic of the 300B and any other SE amps is in the coloration that they provide. so I have most likely wasted a post and said noting.

Bob

markaudio 6th April 2013 02:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mp9 (Post 3442938)

While i no longer have a 300B amp to try, so far i'm happy with the A12P bass driven by a 45 tube SET amp, and the speed is pretty darn excellent.

Hi Mp, (Guys)
I'm keen to expand my amp collection. Could you post more details and your thinking/experiences on the 45 Tube amp? Would be much appreciated:)

Thanks
Mark.


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