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Old 17th January 2013, 11:35 PM   #101
TiMBoZ is offline TiMBoZ  Australia
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"the difference between good hifi and great hifi is what is happening 40 dB down".
Oooh hooly dooly. Nice one. Ok so 'dynamic' is in relation to smaller waves. Resonance rather than oscillation. Nothing to do with what I was talking about. So is there a singular technical term for what I was taking about 'a measure/parameter like 'Q' sort of thing?
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Old 17th January 2013, 11:44 PM   #102
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IMO, the only way to accurately "see" DDR is to scope the output of an amp and then compare it to the output of a [theoretically] "flat" microphone in front of the speaker in a perfectly anaechoic chamber.
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Old 18th January 2013, 12:03 AM   #103
TiMBoZ is offline TiMBoZ  Australia
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To me, I'm hearing it's like micro dynamics (resonance) and macro (oscillate) dynamics - the ability the stop, and change direction for any given wavelength. Macro dynamic to render longer waveforms for bass, to articulate bass oriented sounds and instruments. Micro dynamic to rendershorter waves, to render treble oriented instruments/sounds/spacial cues etc. And everything in between. But there isn't a nice clear line between when the wave gets to swap form to the other. The driver has to attempt to do the lot, all at once. DDR would be applicable across the entire frequency spectrum.
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Old 18th January 2013, 12:39 AM   #104
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Let us consider Mark's term micro-resonance.

Click the image to open in full size.

Now in the diy audio world the term resonance brings an instant negative conotation... we want to avoid box resonance, microphonics in tubes & capacitors, room resonances etc.

But the music itself is a resonant structure (can anyone think of a musical instrument that is not a resonant device?). Matter of fact, if one puts any credance in string theory, our entire reality is the observation of low dimension standing waves of vibrations in a higher dimension universe.

From the diagram (the reality is that music is thousand(s) of times more complex), it seems clear to me that Mark's use of micro-resonance means the ability to recreate those subtle resonances in the music without them being swamped by the big ones. To me another way of saying DDR.

Mark?

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Old 18th January 2013, 12:43 AM   #105
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Another discussion of DDR starting about here EnABL - Technical discussion (doesn't really get going until my reply to Ryan's post)

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Old 18th January 2013, 12:54 AM   #106
TiMBoZ is offline TiMBoZ  Australia
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micro-resonance means the ability to recreate those subtle resonances in the music without them being swamped by the big ones. To me another way of saying DDR.
Yeah fair enough. Within the long ones there would be medium-long ones, within the medium-long ones there medium ones and so on getting ever shorter. The driver has to do all this, at variable SPL/volumes. I think I have a grasp of it now. Thanks
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Old 18th January 2013, 12:57 AM   #107
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Originally Posted by TiMBoZ View Post
To me, I'm hearing it's like micro dynamics (resonance) and macro (oscillate) dynamics - the ability the stop, and change direction for any given wavelength. Macro dynamic to render longer waveforms for bass, to articulate bass oriented sounds and instruments. Micro dynamic to rendershorter waves, to render treble oriented instruments/sounds/spacial cues etc. And everything in between. But there isn't a nice clear line between when the wave gets to swap form to the other. The driver has to attempt to do the lot, all at once. DDR would be applicable across the entire frequency spectrum.
I read what you're saying but not sure I agree. At least not if we're trying to discuss the same thing. I'm considering the very most deep details. The details that really make two oboes in the same orchestra sound different. The details that bring out all the hall ambiance and fully define the space in which a symphony orchestra was recorded. The chest resonance of Pavarotti. The subtle differences in bow technique between Jasha Heifetz and Anna Sophie Mutter that make them instantly distinguishable. That information (nuance, if you will) happens at all frequencies and [generally] not the fundamental frequency of the musical note.

To me, DDR is all about the lowest level of detail that can be reproduced. If we're not reading from the same page, I'd be interested in understanding what you're describing.
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Old 18th January 2013, 01:00 AM   #108
zman01 is offline zman01  Bangladesh
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Originally Posted by planet10 View Post


From the diagram (the reality is that music is thousand(s) of times more complex), it seems clear to me that Mark's use of micro-resonance means the ability to recreate those subtle resonances in the music without them being swamped by the big ones. To me another way of saying DDR.

Mark?

dave
I like this definition. IMHO makes listening to music easier and more pleasurable, as the brain has to try less hard to get details.
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Old 18th January 2013, 01:11 AM   #109
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Originally Posted by planet10 View Post

From the diagram (the reality is that music is thousand(s) of times more complex), it seems clear to me that Mark's use of micro-resonance means the ability to recreate those subtle resonances in the music without them being swamped by the big ones. To me another way of saying DDR.

Mark?

dave
Yeah, that's the ticket.
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Old 18th January 2013, 01:18 AM   #110
TiMBoZ is offline TiMBoZ  Australia
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I think we're talking about the same thing silverhairbp. I'm just trying to nail down, understand for myself the mechanics of how we hear those characteristics you describe. Bass instruments would have upper bass and midrange resonances. Midrange instruments will have low treble resonances and so on. All overlapping up and down the frequency spectrum. I'm taking 'resonance' to mean that the driver doesn't really move, it just rings or resonates, moves a teeensy, teeensy little bit. But it also needs oscillate move a lot - all at once.
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