Still not convinced to go with a fullrange driver but im tempted...

[cotdt]

Originally Posted by Richard Ellis

Can you really afford to experiment with a driver at $110 a pop?
The Alpair comes in at 87Db....that really is a low-efficiency driver...having dealt with 84Db drivers I really hate drivers sucking up power....& giving me, nothing for it.

Point is, Dayton states their 6 1/2" FR drivers at 94.7Db. Something I noted is, some of the FR drivers available now are being built with giant frame assemblies, so you get a 6 1/2" driver with a basket assy more suited to an 8" driver.
Just my 2 cents.



__________________________________________________ _________Rick...

Too bad that that the Dayton doesn't sound very good.

What you get with lower efficiency is a lower bass rolloff point. The efficiency at 100Hz is going to be the same with drivers of equal size, no matter if it's 87dB sensitivity or 95dB sensitivity. Having the response start to roll off at 150Hz is very undesirable if that's the only driver you are going to use. Whereas that 87dB sensitivity driver has a -3dB of 70Hz in a small sealed enclosure and has baffle step already built in so long as it is used within 2 ft from the walls. In a transmission line the flat frequency extension is much lower still.

[markaudio]

Hi Rick,

I've deleted your last post. The Markaudio section is in the commercial side of the forum.

There's a certain irony that you find it easy to side swipe my efforts by promoting a competitor product, who like so many, does little or nothing to engage with the diy-audio community.

Your welcome to repost your point of view provided you don't turn into a promotion for a competitor. You'll need to technically explain exactly why high SPL is so important to you.

Mark.

[markaudio]

Hi Guys,
Regarding the issue of efficiency. Please remember that wanting more SPL comes at a price. There's no free lunch when it comes to driver design. You'll have to give up power-handling and likely have to accept increase damping factors within the driver. Total Q usually drops like a stone, limiting box design choices.

Fine for those like Rick who focus on SPL but I have to satisfy many needs. For the members who know and use Alpair series drivers, you'll be familiar with the relative low mass and wide compliance of their Power-Trains, such that many lower power amps drive Alpairs in allot of projects. Given the Markaudio Power Train and Motor Set designs factor in BSC (baffle step compensation), they offer end-users a great deal of box project choice and versatility.

Cheers
Mark.

[Scottmoose]

Originally Posted by murphythecat8

hi, where is the best cross point so far for a supertweeter?

There isn't any single 'best' point unfortunately. It depends on your particular goals regarding polar response, power-handling for both wideband & tweeter & a host of other factors, same as anything else. I would suggest a low XO point (< 2KHz) would rather negate the point of having a wideband driver in the first place though.

[TiMBoZ]

Cons of A-10: It has a bit of a metallic flavour, the top end is a bit smoothed over...but at frequencies where you're used to hearing a cross over (2-3Khz or 200 - 400Hz ) my A-10 sounds fantastic. There were these details in the sound where I was going "WOW! I didn't know that sound was in there?" Because it was hidden under the XO. Ideally, Full range is hard wired direct to the amp. No coils, caps etc. between amp and driver. So it's very expressive and it really conveys/resolves the emotion of your music. A-10 has a very musical, 'singing' quality to them. It excels at most things in the mid range, voices, flutes (it loves) almost rip a hole in the couch.

[zman01]

TiMBoZ,

How many hours on he A-10? And you mean the Alp 10.2, right?

[tuxedocivic]

I haven't read all the posts here, so I may be just repeating something. But personally I haven't found a fullranger that satisfies me in the HT arena. I enjoy MA drivers a lot. But for HT, I wouldn't use them, or any full ranger for that matter.

If on a strict budget and size constraint, then sure, I would sacrifice what I want out of an HT system and use full range drivers to watch movies. And if going this route, I would no doubt use MA drivers. I wouldn't even shop around. Probably the A7.3 considering the EL70 is drying up. The CHR70 doesn't do it for me, but again, on a strict budget, sure.

[cotdt]

Originally Posted by tuxedocivic

I haven't read all the posts here, so I may be just repeating something. But personally I haven't found a fullranger that satisfies me in the HT arena. I enjoy MA drivers a lot. But for HT, I wouldn't use them, or any full ranger for that matter.

If on a strict budget and size constraint, then sure, I would sacrifice what I want out of an HT system and use full range drivers to watch movies. And if going this route, I would no doubt use MA drivers. I wouldn't even shop around. Probably the A7.3 considering the EL70 is drying up. The CHR70 doesn't do it for me, but again, on a strict budget, sure.

The great thing about MA drivers though is that, unlike most fullrangers, they have great bass relative to size. They also mate very well to tweeters, as they have a flat response instead of midrange shout. This allows them to serve dual purpose as either a fullrange unit or as the midrange in a 2-way or 3-way.

The smaller Alpairs like the 7.3 work great just by itself in an HT setup, though. 5 of those, plus a subwoofer. Is great.

[tuxedocivic]

A good point cotdt, about what you're saying, is that someone could start with a 5.1 using the alp7 and build off of it. As money comes in, add woofers around 200hz. Then more subs. Then ribbon tweeters. At that point it would do what most HT enthusiasts would demand.

[chrisb]

Originally Posted by cotdt

The great thing about MA drivers though is that, unlike most fullrangers, they have great bass relative to size. They also mate very well to tweeters, as they have a flat response instead of midrange shout. This allows them to serve dual purpose as either a fullrange unit or as the midrange in a 2-way or 3-way.

The smaller Alpairs like the 7.3 work great just by itself in an HT setup, though. 5 of those, plus a subwoofer. Is great.

Originally Posted by tuxedocivic

A good point cotdt, about what you're saying, is that someone could start with a 5.1 using the alp7 and build off of it. As money comes in, add woofers around 200hz. Then more subs. Then ribbon tweeters. At that point it would do what most HT enthusiasts would demand.

hmm, I should try that some day, and post my findings (OK if I omit the ribbons? )

Ryan - drop by Gordon Head sometime and hear for yourself