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Old 19th September 2011, 11:34 PM   #21
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Hey Mark,

I would highly appreciate to buy your products at a german distributor. Why? It's the fastest and most comfortable way


BPA was reasonable in terms of price and delivery time, while lacking a bit of communication. However, I would also order at an european shop if the prices of products and delivery costs are reasonable. One tricky subject could be the customer support.Naturally, english is widely spread, but there are still enough ppl who have a language barrier. Another pro argument for a german dealer

Payment methods: Credit cards aren't really popular in germany, in comparision to other countries. In addition, I completely reject paypal for different reasons. In my view, it's no reputable company at all. The so called "Ebay buy protection" is dependent on the goodwill of paypal. Paypals' general terms and conditions are violating against germany law. Just one example.
However, paypal is quite common in Germany.

If a shop has a good reputation, ppl wont bother to make a direct bank transfer. In addition, you can mostly use the "cash on delivery service" for the first purchase which isn't that expensive IMHO.

Regards, Alex

Last edited by AlexGER; 19th September 2011 at 11:38 PM.
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Old 20th September 2011, 04:23 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexGER View Post
Hey Mark,

Payment methods: Credit cards aren't really popular in germany, in comparision to other countries. In addition, I completely reject paypal for different reasons. In my view, it's no reputable company at all. The so called "Ebay buy protection" is dependent on the goodwill of paypal. Paypals' general terms and conditions are violating against germany law. Just one example.
However, paypal is quite common in Germany.

Regards, Alex
Hi Alex,
I'm curious, what's the situation with Paypal and German law?
Paypal is beginning to grow here is Asia but appears more popular in most of EU?

Thanks
Mark.
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Old 20th September 2011, 09:54 AM   #23
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In the limited time i have working on building speakers (2-3 years) I have for most drivers, sourced them from Europeaudio and got them brought into the UK.

However before the temporary site Mark, i was more than happy to order them direct from yourself. That way i can garentee what generation of the driver im getting, and also know it hasn't been tampered with.

I can respect that sending them to multiple countries is possibly very hard work, and thus My vote is Europe audio, despite there of recent way over priced drivers in some cases.

So

No 1 Choice = Direct from yourself
No 2 Choice = Europe Audio

Hope you get the new design up and running soon
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Old 20th September 2011, 09:56 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by markaudio View Post
Hi Alex,
I'm curious, what's the situation with Paypal and German law?
Paypal is beginning to grow here is Asia but appears more popular in most of EU?

Thanks
Mark.
Hey Mark!

Generally spoken, the general terms and conditions of paypal couldn't be used, if pay pal would be a german company. It is not in accordance with german law.

An example: Paypal independently cancelled standing orders at a third party company of their customers, without neither their knowledge nor authorization.
This is forbidden in Germany and violates against civil code § 687 and § 280. (BGB - Einzelnorm , BGB - Einzelnorm I'am sorry but I don't feel I could translate the text in the links properly, it's even hard to understand it in German )
Moreover, those actions also violate paypals' own general terms and conditions.

I'm not a lawyer, but as far as I can see Paypals' business practices are highly doubtful. The general problem in my view is, Paypal is an global player with its own (!) laws which are different from the laws of countries it is used in. That, of course, results in problems and lawsuits.

There are a lot of Paypal critical websites on the www. You may have a look at some. It's just a vast affair and I dont nearly have a full overview about it.

I just found that one (englisch): PayPal Problems & PayPal Answers!
Pretty lurid.

Regards, Alex

Haha, seems like the url got censored

Last edited by AlexGER; 20th September 2011 at 09:59 AM.
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Old 20th September 2011, 07:46 PM   #25
sarte is offline sarte  Finland
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For a recap with few of my personal notes aside. In Finland (and all the other northern european countries) legislation is probably stricktest in europe although germany is probably very close. All the EU countries are basically bound to same laws. There are some differences between countries but not much.

Things that are special to europe vs. rest of the world

1. In EU area there are several things that will make customers buy very safe. One is extended warranty. I have bought several things that only has one year warranty and still got them fixed after warranty period because product should be operational longer than warranty period.
Second is ease of returning stuff you're not happy with. I have once returned a graphics card because it was slower than I thought. No questions asked. Returning the product is free and all delivery costs are refunded. This is guaranteed by law. Many web dealers in Finland sell their returned products with slightly lower costs, because at least in Finland there is a law against selling used (or opened) products without informing about it to customer.
Europeans are used to this kind of treatment and many customers are willing to put some extra cash in, just to have these privileges. If I hadn't been able to get know of Mark through this forum I would never have placed an order. For people who are not experienced online buyers this could and probably will be big point.

2. Europeans are very accustomed to COD (Cash on delivery) or direct bank transfer payment method. I'm doing web shops as a profession and I would say that only about 10% of all finnish web shops have visa/credit card as a payment method. Most popular method is by far is direct bank transfer. Many people don't even have credit card (me included). Visa debit cards (=card has no credit but you can buy stuff abroad. Transaction is directly reduced from your bank account) are pretty common.
Paypal is slowly creeping in, but only with shops that have customers outside Finland. Only people that are used to online shopping abroad have paypal accounts. Many are still afraid to give their credit/debit card numbers to internet services.

3. Bureaucracy is still quite heavy around customs. For example I had to deliver separate document that would prove the value of the binding posts that were sent to me as a gift.
In Finland VAT is 23% and it's collected all orders over 50€. Customs won't be collected if order without delivery is less than 150€ (~200$) (this is different from germany).
With my Alpair 7's the delivery from Hong Kong was quicker than the customs process and delivery from customs to my local post office. It took over 10 days (they just arrived today ) Also I had to do some pretty heavy research just to know what is the correct custom number for plain elements. This was needed to clear the customs in the internet service. Another option would've been 200km round trip to customs office or paying additional fees to national post service to do customs for me.

All in all. To me ordering expensive stuff (over 50€ reasons described before) was an adventure that I wanted to experience. At least in Finland I would be hesitant to recommend this to my friends. Best experience was over the top customer service provided by Mark. The rest... well let's say I'm not ordering anything outside EU for a while if I'm not absolutely forced to do so. There's just too much hassle.

I would be more than happy to buy from any european dealer that has english customer service.

Last edited by sarte; 20th September 2011 at 07:49 PM.
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Old 20th September 2011, 09:25 PM   #26
RumoH is offline RumoH  Netherlands
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My shop carries 2 languages, dutch and englisch. For most of the world this more than sufficient to handle service to costumers.

Notification: We are trying to get the new MA drivers in stock ASAP.

Rudy
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Old 31st October 2011, 09:42 AM   #27
JaapF is offline JaapF  Netherlands
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Hello Mark,

Any news and/or progress relating to European distributors? I want to start exploring FR and the CHP-70 Gen2 looks like a nice driver for a project I have in mind. But as far as I could tell, not available in europe yet....

Regards, Jaap
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Old 31st October 2011, 10:51 AM   #28
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Originally Posted by JaapF View Post
Hello Mark,
Any news and/or progress relating to European distributors? I want to start exploring FR and the CHP-70 Gen2 looks like a nice driver for a project I have in mind. But as far as I could tell, not available in europe yet....

Regards, Jaap
Hi Jaap,
New arrangements are being made. Hope I can give you more information later this week.
Thanks
Mark.
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Old 31st October 2011, 03:05 PM   #29
Aad is offline Aad  Netherlands
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Thats good news!
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Old 7th November 2011, 04:03 PM   #30
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Now that The end of the week is over and the new one has just begun, are there any news for europeans?

Regards

sky
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