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-   -   MA Woofer Number 6 as subwoofer driver? (http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/markaudio/195537-ma-woofer-number-6-subwoofer-driver.html)

blakkshepeaudio 29th August 2011 03:21 AM

MA Woofer Number 6 as subwoofer driver?
 
Greetings.

MA woofer number 6 (aka CSS EL166, I think) looks like a low cost, good performing driver. I know it was designed to facilitate simple two way designs and has a well behaved midrange.

BUT...

Has anyone tried one in a small-ish,medium power subwoofer role?

6 1/2 inch sub drivers seem to be in short supply in OZ (happy to stand corrected if someone can point me otherwise) and I just wondered if these might be worth a try.

Not their designed role, but maybe OK anyway.

rgds
blakkshepeaudio

planet10 29th August 2011 03:25 AM

I don't know if they qualify as a sub, but the MTM ML-TLs mine are in sure make bass.

dave

blakkshepeaudio 29th August 2011 04:37 AM

Yeah, I really only want a solid 40Hz in a not-huge box. Not a sub at all I guess but a dedicated LF system.

Models sort of OK but am really looking for user comments on quality and quantity of output.

I will look into your ML-TL as well and am pleased to hear they make-a-da-plentybass!

rgds
blakk

chrisb 29th August 2011 05:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blakkshepeaudio (Post 2689692)
Yeah, I really only want a solid 40Hz in a not-huge box. Not a sub at all I guess but a dedicated LF system.

Models sort of OK but am really looking for user comments on quality and quantity of output.

I will look into your ML-TL as well and am pleased to hear they make-a-da-plentybass!

rgds
blakk

For the record, the enclosure to which Dave refers is not a tiny box go hide in the corner, but an MTM with, in our case Fostex FF85K (no doubt you could insert your favorite flavor of mid-tweek here____)

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/attac...2011_spk01.jpg

yes, their prodigious LF output was surprising - indeed the enclosures could use either some additional bracing and/or internal damping



BTW, that's about the tidiest I've seen this room in over 10yrs, and not that's not Cal's summer cabin on the video screen

it's Terry's

planet10 29th August 2011 05:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrisb (Post 2689700)
For the record, the enclosure to which Dave refers is not a tiny box go hide in the corner

It could halved by using a sngle driver, and then folded to get about half as tall(pretty much making it same footprint, half as tall)

There is also a smaller version of the ML-TL

dave

18Hurts 29th August 2011 06:34 PM

Interesting,

I know Mark made up a post to inform people they are NOT woofers. The ultra-thin cones can buckle if you hit Xmech.

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/marka...t-woofers.html

I found a Vifa 6.5" subwoofer with free shipping (10 to 15 days) to OZ for $96 US.

http://www.dhgate.com/vifa-bc18sg59-...cb5eb2081.html

What I like about subwoofers is they can take a beating and not be the worse for wear. The Alpairs are known for their midrange, although it would work as a bass unit...I just think for a dedicated 40Hz bass unit, an actual subwoofer or at least a woofer would work better.

Crumpling a cone is never fun. :bawling:

zman01 29th August 2011 06:51 PM

18Hurts,

The Woff #6 or CSS EL166 are not Alpairs - they are paper cone mid-bass/woofer units. Have a pretty low Fs of 32 IIRC.

planet10 29th August 2011 07:01 PM

+ 1 on what Zia says.

EL166/No 6 are (mid)woofers.

dave

markaudio 30th August 2011 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 18Hurts (Post 2690330)
Interesting,

I know Mark made up a post to inform people they are NOT woofers. The ultra-thin cones can buckle if you hit Xmech.

http://www.diyaudio.com/forums/marka...t-woofers.html

I found a Vifa 6.5" subwoofer with free shipping (10 to 15 days) to OZ for $96 US.

What I like about subwoofers is they can take a beating and not be the worse for wear. The Alpairs are known for their midrange, although it would work as a bass unit...I just think for a dedicated 40Hz bass unit, an actual subwoofer or at least a woofer would work better.

Crumpling a cone is never fun. :bawling:

Hi H, guys,
If you're in need of more power (large room, into big amps and like to play loud), sub's are likely the better way to go.

From my perspective (driver designer, builder), subs have serious limitations. To handle higher power loads, their emitting surfaces need to be strong so increased mass is inevitable. This sacrifices resonance output. Controlling inertia is a major challenge, hence the need for large (sometimes hugh) suspensions just to keep the power-train within moderate linear tolerances. Effectively, subs are about delivering quantity rather than quality. I know 5 driver designers in factories around my location, none use subs in their own systems.

I think the more interesting challenge is to design drivers and systems that are minimalist, delivering the widest usable output and range with the least amount of components. That's why I love listening to Pencils. Built right and located for room gain, they can knock out some great bass with detail.

But, I fully appreciate there are many tastes in audio (hence my Woof 6 and Tweet 3 work). For those who want or need large output, there would be a need to look for drivers with more beef and subs could be the answer for their needs.

Cheers
Mark.

blakkshepeaudio 30th August 2011 02:39 AM

Thanks all for your replies.

My original message was pretty poorly worded, in hindsight, and has caused confusion.

I design and build systems to fit into bad, bad acoustic situations (eg. into existing pieces of furniture, public places etc.). I try to get excellent performance from systems that are fundamentally compromised and non-negotiable in physical layout.

Coax and widerange drivers are very useful, given the limited real estate I often have to work with. The performance demands of some clients mean that some otherwise good candidate drivers just won't cut the mustard for LF output in larger rooms.

So what I am really after is a modestly sized woofer of good quality, modest price and robust construction which can go up smoothly to a few hundred hertz (most of them) and down to the top of sub territory (35-40Hz, not so many) to perform LF duties in systems where higher SPLs are required. The LF sections would be routinely separated from the fullrange by tens of centimeters and used one per channel (mostly).

So my original 'sub' story is only half true. They are ,more correctly, for 'detached' LF sections of 'low crossever freqency' 2ways with FR/Coax drivers.
Phew.
Hope that explains it better.

Rgds
blakk


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