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Old 5th June 2011, 03:02 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by zman01 View Post
Dave,

Is the rounding over corners in the case of Super Pensil 12 mainly a choice of aesthetics, or does it provide any acoustic benefits also e.g. like the chamfers on an Onken? I vaguely recall a thread recommending rounding over for other speakers too.

-Zia
I did them purely for aesthetics so if there's a sonic benefit as well then its a bonus I didn't count on Dave will know for certain though.

Scott
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Old 5th June 2011, 03:55 PM   #42
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Scott,

It is also good to listen the single full range driver without bracing and try to add bracing (holy bracing Scott designed) and compare the difference on sound.

Thanks,
Tony.

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Thanks Tony!

I have not yet done the bracing but plan on it once I get an initial listen. I have never heard a single driver setup and have been building these on faith and hope so I want to make sure I like them before I go through all the work of building the bracing. We'll see tomorrow what my initial impression is

Scott
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Old 5th June 2011, 08:33 PM   #43
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A round over is effective for frequencies on the same order of the radius. HF only for small radius, to get useful down into the LF the roundover/chempher needs to become significant compared to the baffle width.

dave
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Old 5th June 2011, 08:57 PM   #44
zman01 is offline zman01  Bangladesh
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A round over is effective for frequencies on the same order of the radius. HF only for small radius, to get useful down into the LF the roundover/chempher needs to become significant compared to the baffle width.

dave
Dave,

For the ignorant like me that means for a baffle the width of Super Pensil 12, a small round over will not yield any benefits in LF at all.

HF maybe a little benefit, nothing much.

Am I right in decoding?

-Zia
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Old 5th June 2011, 09:03 PM   #45
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No. To put a serious roundover on P12 you'd need so add a couple more layers of material on the sides.

dave
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Old 6th June 2011, 03:51 AM   #46
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Well, they are all put together now, sans bracing. There seems to be a decent amount of panel resonance so I'm definitely going to build the bracing for them. The big side panels I'm guessing are the main culprits. I put 1.5lbs of stuffing in and the bass seems about right; not muddy at all. Initial impressions by both my wife and myself are that they sound very good, much better than we had thought they were going to. They are imaging incredibly well. Highs are definitely there and are crisp, clear and articulate without being harsh. Bass is surprising and what I was really worried about: its there! Haha! I'm coming from mains with built in 8" subs with a 350w amp so I'm used to a lot of low end reinforcement. While these aren't outputting the quantity of bass, they are definitely putting out quality bass and I don't feel that its lacking at all. I'm extremely surprised and impressed!!

All that said, I made a mistake on the 2nd cabinet and ended up putting the driver 1-1/4" too high. I don't know how I did it but I obviously measured wrong so I'm going to have to build another cabinet. Not a huge deal but a pain none-the-less.

Anyway, I have to say I'm VERY impressed and really liking what I hear. I've only been listening for about 1/2 hour so these are all initial impressions. I'm going to give it a while and work at redoing the other cabinet and build all the bracing.

Good work Mark, Dave and Scott! These are fantastic!!

Scott
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Old 6th June 2011, 04:04 AM   #47
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Listening to Owl City: Meteor Shower as its a great mixed song with lots of low bass and crisp highs. The bass is astonishingly clear with this track and the highs (which can get VERY harsh with Owl City very easily) are not harsh at all but rather very even. At the beginning of the track there is a woman very faintly singing and I've never heard her on that track before on ANY system! My 2k Strata Mini's don't resolve it and these $300/pr drivers in my humble home built cabinets do. WOW!
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Old 7th June 2011, 02:48 PM   #48
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So last night my wife and I were watching Top Gear on Netflix. I have for the last few years really liked the presentation that my center channel gives. It is a partially open baffle configuration where the outside drivers are in sealed cabinets and the inside are open. It creates a very open and natural sounding soundstage and I've always been very impressed with its clarity. Well last night, for grins, I turned off the center channel and just put the system in 2-CH stereo to get an idea of what having an ALP12 center would be like. Holy Cow! The clarity was SO MUCH better than the X-Voce that I have! Dialog was so much clearer and more precise. Looks like I'm going to be building that center channel after all

Dave had given me the idea of using the Classic Golden Ratio Mar-Ken12 and turning it on its side. That's definitely an option but I was kinda hoping for something bigger. I'd really like to have an f3 in the 50's or 60's so I can be totally flat to 80hz where I cross over to my subs. Any suggestions or will the GRMK12 get there?

Scott
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Old 7th June 2011, 06:12 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by skeeter99 View Post
So last night my wife and I were watching Top Gear on Netflix. I have for the last few years really liked the presentation that my center channel gives. It is a partially open baffle configuration where the outside drivers are in sealed cabinets and the inside are open. It creates a very open and natural sounding soundstage and I've always been very impressed with its clarity. Well last night, for grins, I turned off the center channel and just put the system in 2-CH stereo to get an idea of what having an ALP12 center would be like. Holy Cow! The clarity was SO MUCH better than the X-Voce that I have! Dialog was so much clearer and more precise. Looks like I'm going to be building that center channel after all

Dave had given me the idea of using the Classic Golden Ratio Mar-Ken12 and turning it on its side. That's definitely an option but I was kinda hoping for something bigger. I'd really like to have an f3 in the 50's or 60's so I can be totally flat to 80hz where I cross over to my subs. Any suggestions or will the GRMK12 get there?

Scott

Scott: I've not been particularly interested enough to research the subject, but are there clear specs (that are followed) for the frequency bandwidth of center channel mixing? - in other worlds if THX is not a dirty word here, what is required to meet "home cinema specifications??


I'd imagine that even if the GRMK12's in room f3 isn't neatly inside your desired range (which I frankly doubt it couldn't reach), if you're crossing the full front row over at 80Hz, the combination of Pensils and center should have no trouble getting you flat to that point.


In approx 2500ft^3 room, with main listening position approx 10f from front row, the much smaller Alp 7 crossed over at 110(?) are quite capable for my needs, but then I don't listen at 100+ dB "reference levels"
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Old 7th June 2011, 06:34 PM   #50
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Scott: I've not been particularly interested enough to research the subject, but are there clear specs (that are followed) for the frequency bandwidth of center channel mixing? - in other worlds if THX is not a dirty word here, what is required to meet "home cinema specifications??


I'd imagine that even if the GRMK12's in room f3 isn't neatly inside your desired range (which I frankly doubt it couldn't reach), if you're crossing the full front row over at 80Hz, the combination of Pensils and center should have no trouble getting you flat to that point.


In approx 2500ft^3 room, with main listening position approx 10f from front row, the much smaller Alp 7 crossed over at 110(?) are quite capable for my needs, but then I don't listen at 100+ dB "reference levels"
I don't think THX is a dirty word at all. The THX standard is for 80hz crossovers from all speakers to the subs. That's what I use and my subs do VERY well with the low stuff! My goal is to get flat to 80hz and let my duals take it from there. As long as I can get the front three there, then I'm good. Obviously the SuperPensils get there no problem so I just need to make sure the center I build get there too.

I do listen loud from time to time but not that often anymore with an 11 month old just up the stairs and I don't have my dedicated theater anymore. I was listening to some techno last night crossed to the subs and I couldn't detect any breakup or distortion and the drivers were barely moving.
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