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Old 12th January 2010, 09:39 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by norman bates View Post
Perhaps the 50mm could have a tiny frame being something along the lines of the bandors or the tiny jordans (meant to be used in a vertical array of 4 drivers).
A quick sketch based on the Alpair 5 drawing.

dave
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Old 12th January 2010, 09:43 PM   #22
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Originally Posted by woody View Post
Have you considered offering your drivers in 600 ohm versions like Phillips did 50 years
ago? If Phillips could wind a 600ohm voice coil 50 years ago how hard could it be now with better materials?
600 ohms would certainly open up a whole revival of the OTL amps you'd use to drive these... could well be a chicken & egg thing.

Of more immediate practical use would be 32 ohm VC. Then you could parallel 8 up and still have a practical impedance.

dave
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Old 12th January 2010, 10:05 PM   #23
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IIRC the aforementioned old Philips drivers were in fact 800ohm units, created primarily, as Dave hints toward, because OPTs are damned expensive, & they were trying to do without them. Only problem was the VC's had a nasty habit of frying, which isn't much of a surprise given the wire & windings necessary.

Mark -just as a handful of general observations (need more time to ponder properly)

1/ Low cost = possibly good market move
2/ It looks pretty (no bad thing)
3/ My take would be to be useable from 500Hz - whatever top-end you favour. In practice, that's ideally going to need an Fs an octave or more lower. If you want the Japanese market, you'll want to take it as high as practicable for a modestly priced unit, although in my personal opinion, massive extension past our HF hearing threshold can often divert attention from other things that are of more practical use, such as improving midband linearity. Bit of a catch 22 unfortunately, just musing aloud, so to speak.
4/ Considerable power-handling is unnecessary if you limit the LF extension. If, for e.g., you analyse the power-distibution of a symphony orchestra by frequency, the majority falls below 500Hz (which is why it's one of the better XO points within the human critical hearing BW [nee 'midrange'] defined by Bell Labs ~8 decades ago as 200Hz - 4KHz, and amply revealed by the Fletcher-Munson / Equal Loudness curves). Above this, relatively little is needed. So, if you limit the BW & let those drivers handle the LF that are actually designed for it, high power-handling does not become such a critical issue. Over simplistic, just thrown out as a general thought really.
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Last edited by Scottmoose; 12th January 2010 at 10:13 PM.
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Old 13th January 2010, 01:22 AM   #24
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Hi Dave, Scott,
Good thinking - many thanks. Technically, there's lots of merit in the suggestions. It really comes down to saleability. A driver that can go 100-20K comes in handy for more applications. This is critical in the low end of the market. Margins are extra tight and I'll have to make a larger quantity, expected minimum of 2000 units into stock. On the other hand, there's few dedicated cone tweets available.

That's been the challenge for the Alpair 5. It is essentially a wide cone tweet although it became useful in wide band mini-applications as a stand-alone driver. But its high production cost has put it beyond the reach of many.

So, its down to what's going to work commercially - A wide (ish) low cost tiny tot cone driver, or a cone tweet with a high (ish Fo). Ummmmmmph?????

Hi Tinitus,
I'm not sure why you think I and other professional driver designers and makers haven't done what you suggest. There's been lots of experimentation over many years by designers with considerable knowledge. Your last sentence has some merit.

Thanks

Mark.
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Old 13th January 2010, 02:20 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markaudio View Post
Hi Tinitus,
I'm not sure why you think I and other professional driver designers and makers haven't done what you suggest.

Mark.
I only suggested exactly what other professional designers do
Theres a clear tendency towards thicker poleplates
And underhung design especially with tweeters
With a short Xmax driver theres no or little loss with underhung design
Thats simply how it is
Lots of design tricks are really just revival of older stuff
Nothing new really
How its actually done seems mostly to be a matter of cost and budget
Its also often obvious that many driver designers dont know how a complete speaker design works, in general
Even the Feastrex company had no proper box plans for their drivers, fore a long time
A bit strange really

Btw, some time ago I told PerSkåning/Audiotechnology that there might be a good market fore a quality cone tweeter
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Old 13th January 2010, 02:50 AM   #26
dobias is offline dobias  United States
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Gentlemen,
I hope my request falls inline with this thread:
My wife has given me a 'mission impossible', er, challenge. She wants a low volume bedroom set with the smallest speakers available.
Can anyone point me to drivers & enclosures that have already been worked out?
The whole concept is foreign to me but I'd like something I can at least tolerate.
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Old 13th January 2010, 03:37 AM   #27
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Hi Dobias,
You have an interesting situation (wife pleasing).
What size is your bedroom?

Thanks

Mark.
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Old 13th January 2010, 03:59 AM   #28
dobias is offline dobias  United States
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Default Tiny Speakers

MarkAudio,
It's about 18 ft. square.

Last edited by markaudio; 13th January 2010 at 04:33 AM.
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Old 13th January 2010, 04:08 AM   #29
dobias is offline dobias  United States
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MarkAudio,
The present lodgings aren't the design criterion.
We're both in our seventies & she's anticipating she'll be living with her daughter in less spacious quarters after I've croaked. :-)
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Old 13th January 2010, 04:14 AM   #30
EUVL is offline EUVL  Europe
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Mark,

You are pulling out new chasses faster than people can make enclosures for them.
I admire your dedication !!!!



Patrick
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