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Old 24th January 2010, 07:46 PM   #11
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Actually, now that I think about it, when we use full range drivers, our volume level where we sit is usually below 80-90db.

I know you are aware of the fletcher-munson curve. The rise in the high end and a bit of midbass/bass boost is welcome due to our lower sensitivity at low volumes. Or the smile on the equalizer settings that sounds better to 9 out of 10 people (or more).

A while back, I added a baffle step woofer (so I had 2 x 15's a side). The inductor pole was near 350hz. At low volumes, adding the baffle step woofer made no difference to the sound. That blew my mind. At medium volume it made a little difference, but at high volume it made a huge difference.

I had a friend who made and sold speakers through a local dealer (time aligned 3 way with the unobtainable wonderfull 94db phillips 5 1/4" full range with a copper cap cloth edge paper cone, AD5061M8 full range). It was also used by Infinity,Genesis, and Dahlquist. "The only speaker near their price range that sounded better on acoustic guitar was the original Quad electrostat(in the early 70's).I wish I could find a case of these midrange drivers somewhere." from my friend.

He got them perfectly flat (+/-2db).
Most didn't like flat at 20khz.
He one time ran out of the correct resisitors for the midrange driver, so he had it -3db down compared to the tweet / woofer. Customers prefered them over the standard flat response, and the dealer wanted them with the lower midrange.

Norman
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Old 25th January 2010, 08:31 AM   #12
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Listened Alpair 10 Generation 2 in bookshelf cabinets and compared to Alpair 10 previous version with Mark yesterday. Very impressive for the performance. The sound of new version is more transparent and detailed then the previous one. It is easier to drive and sounds good with lower powered tube amplifiers.

Cheers.

Tony.
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Old 25th January 2010, 02:44 PM   #13
ilwooz is offline ilwooz  Italy
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Hi everybody,
Having bought only few months ago the Alpair 10 Gen 1 and worked very hard to assemble the cabinets (that are not finished yet, so, at now, I still don't play music through them...), honestly is really not a happy news to know that there will be soon (so soon...) an improved version of the same drivers...
Of course " la vita", "c'est la vie".
However I'm very very satisfied with my Alpair 10 Gen 1 so... thanks anyway and very much Mr. Mark! Your drivers are awesome.
Best regards,
Christian
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Old 25th January 2010, 09:34 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ilwooz View Post
Hi everybody,
Having bought only few months ago the Alpair 10 Gen 1 and worked very hard to assemble the cabinets (that are not finished yet, so, at now, I still don't play music through them...), honestly is really not a happy news to know that there will be soon (so soon...) an improved version of the same drivers...
Of course " la vita", "c'est la vie". However I'm very very satisfied with my Alpair 10 Gen 1 so... thanks anyway and very much Mr. Mark! Your drivers are awesome.
Best regards,
Christian
Hi Christian,
Sorry to bring you the news. But not to worry. The current Alp10's are well liked. Reviews in Europe and feedback on this forum say this driver's plays well.

Being an engineer, I'm always wanting to "tweak" this or that on my drivers. Force of habit for many engineers and designers. It partly why I spend so much time inside the factories, it gives me opportunities to think about the whole process of designing and building drivers.

I've let forum members know about my development work at earlier stages in order to receive more feedback. The downside is current models can be sort of "up-staged" by my efforts. I guess this is why Apple computers keep their new products under-wraps until the launch day.

All the same, I think me asking for feedback from guys like yourself is worth it. I'm trying to develop drivers that Diyers and custom builders really want, rather than have drivers pushed on to the market without any consultation.

Any chance of making a thread in Full Range forum about your project? Work in progress with pics can be interesting.

Cheers

Mark.
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Old 25th January 2010, 09:56 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by norman bates View Post
Actually, now that I think about it, when we use full range drivers, our volume level where we sit is usually below 80-90db.
I know you are aware of the fletcher-munson curve. The rise in the high end and a bit of midbass/bass boost is welcome due to our lower sensitivity at low volumes. Or the smile on the equalizer settings that sounds better to 9 out of 10 people (or more).

A while back, I added a baffle step woofer (so I had 2 x 15's a side). The inductor pole was near 350hz. At low volumes, adding the baffle step woofer made no difference to the sound. That blew my mind. At medium volume it made a little difference, but at high volume it made a huge difference.

Norman
Hi Norman,
Very interesting comments. Yes, Fletcher & Munson, also Robinson and Dadson (et.al ISO 226 standard 1956). It's a very interesting topic and also relates to this thread:

Upper Limits of Human Hearing

Cheers,

Mark.
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Old 26th January 2010, 09:54 AM   #16
ilwooz is offline ilwooz  Italy
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Hi Mark,
First of all, thanks for Your response. My previous post was just a candid expression about my feelings but, mostly, an opportunity to manifest my appreciation to Your great work. In these months I had the opportunity to listen my Alpair 10 during the "tuning stage" (mainly to experiment and find the best, to my ears, amount of dumping material inside the cabinets) and I'm just amazed about the sound quality, in my modest experience simply the best Full Range (the drivers I like best) I've heard until now (I've had or I have listened to some excellent Fostex and JohnBlue).
It's always been clear that Your approach to "speakers making" is a constant "tweak and development", that's just a quality assurance for all the DIY community, I think everyone can only appreciates.
Quote:
Any chance of making a thread in Full Range forum about your project? Work in progress with pics can be interesting.
Sure, I'm doing step by step photos and when the speakers will be finished I'll indeed post my project on the forum.
Thanks again and have a nice day,
Christian
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Old 1st March 2010, 10:24 AM   #17
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Hi Guys,

Re Alpair 10 new frame covers - "To glue or not to glue, that is the question".

Please take a look at the new thread in Full Range and vote and/or comment on the the Alpair 10 cover fixing issue.

Alpair-10: to cover or not to cover, that is the question

Cheers

Mark
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Old 6th March 2010, 04:59 AM   #18
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Seems that most like the cover to be included but not attached (so it can be a drop in replacement).
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Old 2nd April 2010, 12:08 PM   #19
timpert is offline timpert  Netherlands
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Hi Mark,

Will the new Alpair 10 also be available in two colors for the cone? I like the grey version more.
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Old 2nd April 2010, 11:18 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timpert View Post
Hi Mark,
Will the new Alpair 10 also be available in two colors for the cone? I like the grey version more.
Hi Timpert,
Yes, we expect to make both colours (gold and grey).
Thanks
Mark.
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